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FF Soccer All-Time XI Draft - Finals - kempus vs. amac
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Which Team will Win
kempus
62%
 62%  [ 15 ]
amac
37%
 37%  [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 24

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dotmotion


Joined: 20 May 2008
Posts: 12102
Location: Vancouver
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing I do have to note is that Krol although versatile rarely played RB. From the games I've seen, mostly World Cups and European Championships, he has been pushed left or played centrally. I am not saying he won't be effective just at his best he is a LB or CB.

However as players at their peak, I think he is better than Giggs and should be able to contain him.
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kempus


Joined: 09 Jan 2008
Posts: 17297
Location: An economy based on endless growth is, UNSUSTAINABLE!
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dotmotion wrote:
One thing I do have to note is that Krol although versatile rarely played RB. From the games I've seen, mostly World Cups and European Championships, he has been pushed left or played centrally. I am not saying he won't be effective just at his best he is a LB or CB.

However as players at their peak, I think he is better than Giggs and should be able to contain him.


Dude, really?

Giggs is arguably one of the best left wingers ever. I have watched him for he last 15 years and can't think of any who possess his combination of stamina, speed, dribbling ability, finishing ability and crossing. I would back Giggs against pretty much any RB ever. Krol is miles away from being the best right back of all time, this isn't even a contest in my opinion.

Also, I can't even be bothered to argue about Zico or Laudrup. Laudrup was the better player and it shouldn't even be discussed. All of those greats didn't say those things for the sake of it. I'm pretty happy to take their opinion.
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amac


Joined: 11 Aug 2011
Posts: 3601
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dotmotion wrote:
Personally, I think Zico's vision and passing ability is on par with Laudrap but we just don't see it in the way he plays. Let me go back to that example. There is no doubt in my mind that Messi can drop in the MC and be just as good in his vision and passing range as Xavi, but we don't see it as much because he plays high up the pitch and has less room to operate.


exactly my point

dotmotion wrote:
One thing I do have to note is that Krol although versatile rarely played RB. From the games I've seen, mostly World Cups and European Championships, he has been pushed left or played centrally. I am not saying he won't be effective just at his best he is a LB or CB.


i read somewhere that he was right footed and originally started on the right, and could play any defensive postion. im guessing the presence of Suurbier pushed him to the left
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Last edited by amac on Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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amac


Joined: 11 Aug 2011
Posts: 3601
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kempus wrote:
dotmotion wrote:
One thing I do have to note is that Krol although versatile rarely played RB. From the games I've seen, mostly World Cups and European Championships, he has been pushed left or played centrally. I am not saying he won't be effective just at his best he is a LB or CB.

However as players at their peak, I think he is better than Giggs and should be able to contain him.


Dude, really?

Giggs is arguably one of the best left wingers ever. I have watched him for he last 15 years and can't think of any who possess his combination of stamina, speed, dribbling ability, finishing ability and crossing. I would back Giggs against pretty much any RB ever. Krol is miles away from being the best right back of all time, this isn't even a contest in my opinion.

Also, I can't even be bothered to argue about Zico or Laudrup. Laudrup was the better player and it shouldn't even be discussed. All of those greats didn't say those things for the sake of it. I'm pretty happy to take their opinion.


thats a ridiculous way of judging players, i could probably pull hundreds of quotes like that about Zico. and Krol was undoubtedly one of the best fullbacks of all time imo.
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kempus


Joined: 09 Jan 2008
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Location: An economy based on endless growth is, UNSUSTAINABLE!
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

amac wrote:
kempus wrote:
dotmotion wrote:
One thing I do have to note is that Krol although versatile rarely played RB. From the games I've seen, mostly World Cups and European Championships, he has been pushed left or played centrally. I am not saying he won't be effective just at his best he is a LB or CB.

However as players at their peak, I think he is better than Giggs and should be able to contain him.


Dude, really?

Giggs is arguably one of the best left wingers ever. I have watched him for he last 15 years and can't think of any who possess his combination of stamina, speed, dribbling ability, finishing ability and crossing. I would back Giggs against pretty much any RB ever. Krol is miles away from being the best right back of all time, this isn't even a contest in my opinion.

Also, I can't even be bothered to argue about Zico or Laudrup. Laudrup was the better player and it shouldn't even be discussed. All of those greats didn't say those things for the sake of it. I'm pretty happy to take their opinion.


thats a ridiculous way of judging players, i could probably pull hundreds of quotes like that about Zico. and Krol was undoubtedly one of the best fullbacks of all time imo.


Ok then, get your quotes out.
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dotmotion


Joined: 20 May 2008
Posts: 12102
Location: Vancouver
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kempus wrote:
Also, I can't even be bothered to argue about Zico or Laudrup. Laudrup was the better player and it shouldn't even be discussed. All of those greats didn't say those things for the sake of it. I'm pretty happy to take their opinion.

How did this guy not get drafted

Quote:
"He is one of the best players I have ever seen and one of the best players in the history of football."
Franz Beckenbauer

Quote:
"Kenny had unbelievable vision and strength as a player. He was really aware of people around him. He had great balance and was a good finisher, courageous too. People often forget that the one quality great players need is courage. Kenny is as brave as a lion. He would take a kick from anyone and come back for more. Kenny is a man I shall always respect."
Sir Alex Ferguson

Quote:
"I suppose above everything else when you try to assess Kenny's importance you must talk about his attitude to the game. He just wanted to play football. He had tremendous skill and the ability to set the pace of the game for the other players around him. When I had to sell Kevin Keegan to Hamburg and we didn't have any choice because Kevin wanted to go to Europe I didn't think it would be possible to replace him. Yet we did it so easily by buying Kenny from Celtic. In many ways he was a better player for Liverpool than Kevin was. Kenny is a model professional and was the best buy we ever made it's as simple as that."
Bob Paisley

Quote:
"Jimmy Greaves and Kenny Dalglish had similar know-how, but Dalglish's knowledge and reading of the game was far superior. He was the most complete footballer in British soccer."
Former England international Jimmy Armfield

Quote:
"Kenny was the best Scottish player I ever played with. He could hold his own in any company and go anywhere in the world. He was a genuine world-class player."
Billy McNeill

Quote:
"When I was growing up my hero was Di Stefano. Kenny for me was on a par with Di Stefano. That is the best compliment I can pay him."
George Best

Quote:
"Kenny is Liverpool's greatest ever player simply I played with him and he made a lot of my goals. He gave me the confidence that I needed. Whenever Kenny had the ball I always knew it was going to come to me."
Ian Rush

Seems like a GOAT to me. Oh I should add more cause this seems irrelevant. Just because there are quotes doesn't mean the player is good. Player say great things about people. If I have never watched football and I've read this quotes, I would tend to believe Dalglish is a top 10 player of all time. However, I have watched him play and watched him play a lot. He although is a talented player, he is not as great as Di Stefano, or one of the best ever as Beckenbauer says. Overall, quotes are good and can help back an argument but to use it as a sole as you sort of did, is just ridiculous.
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kempus


Joined: 09 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your quotes are feeble. 'Best Scottish player ever' 'He was the most complete player in British soccer.' Bah, did anyone say he was the best ever?

Quotes have to be taken into context, but when you see the likes of Romario, Raul, Guardiola, Mourinho, Crujff, Beckenbauer, Iniesta and Figo calling him the best ever, you have to take notice.

Quote:
Overall, quotes are good and can help back an argument but to use it as a sole as you sort of did, is just ridiculous.


Here it is just a couple of guys, who have never played football to any level having a discussion. One opinion vs another. If you are then to add in opinions from people who have played the game at the very highest level, then it is perfectly good to rely upon them.
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dotmotion


Joined: 20 May 2008
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Location: Vancouver
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kempus wrote:
Your quotes are feeble. 'Best Scottish player ever' 'He was the most complete player in British soccer.' Bah, did anyone say he was the best ever?

Quotes have to be taken into context, but when you see the likes of Romario, Raul, Guardiola, Mourinho, Crujff, Beckenbauer, Iniesta and Figo calling him the best ever, you have to take notice.

I'll take it into context. Raul, Romario, Guardiola, Crujff, Iniesta, Figo.. Somewhat Mourinho have all played, managed on a club that Laudrap has played for.

I just can't accept that you say Laudrup is a better player because that is what other people say. It is like writing a paper. You can provide expert quotes but that is to back up your argument or opinion. I can accept what sox says. He believes that Laudrup has better vision than Zico, I can take that. All you said is that they play different positions, thats true, and then put up a bunch of expert facts. Why do you think Laudrup is a better player?
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kempus


Joined: 09 Jan 2008
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Location: An economy based on endless growth is, UNSUSTAINABLE!
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dotmotion wrote:
kempus wrote:
Your quotes are feeble. 'Best Scottish player ever' 'He was the most complete player in British soccer.' Bah, did anyone say he was the best ever?

Quotes have to be taken into context, but when you see the likes of Romario, Raul, Guardiola, Mourinho, Crujff, Beckenbauer, Iniesta and Figo calling him the best ever, you have to take notice.

I'll take it into context. Raul, Romario, Guardiola, Crujff, Iniesta, Figo.. Somewhat Mourinho have all played, managed on a club that Laudrap has played for.


Indeed, which is a double edged sword. They are the perfect ones to say it as they have played with him and seen him play on a regular basis. However, of course they may be biased towards players from their own club. How often do you hear players calling others the greatest of all time though, whether they are on the same team or not its not something which is a regular occurrence.
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