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Serie A Thread - Conte for Allegri....
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dhunt2402


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

teamorange wrote:
I still think you guys are a bit too young and inexperienced to be viewed as title contenders. You guys will be at the top but I can only really see Juventus winning Serie A this year.


They will, the race is really for second/third (and even second I think is Napoli's to lose, but they always have a significant lull in their season). Too small a sample size to determine how we'll handle a full season, but there's nothing inexperienced about the players, especially when Aquilani and El Hamdaoui return. Inexperienced as a unit perhaps, but they're already playing phenomenally well together (especially the midfield). A lot remains to be seen, but can't help but be incredibly optimistic after playing the consensus best team in Italy off the pitch.
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ArodFanboy


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

teamorange wrote:
I still think you guys are a bit too young and inexperienced to be viewed as title contenders. You guys will be at the top but I can only really see Juventus winning Serie A this year.


Milan will rise again!!




nah, just kidding. Were screwed.
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teamorange


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dhunt2402 wrote:
teamorange wrote:
I still think you guys are a bit too young and inexperienced to be viewed as title contenders. You guys will be at the top but I can only really see Juventus winning Serie A this year.


They will, the race is really for second/third (and even second I think is Napoli's to lose, but they always have a significant lull in their season). Too small a sample size to determine how we'll handle a full season, but there's nothing inexperienced about the players, especially when Aquilani and El Hamdaoui return. Inexperienced as a unit perhaps, but they're already playing phenomenally well together (especially the midfield). A lot remains to be seen, but can't help but be incredibly optimistic after playing the consensus best team in Italy off the pitch.


That's what I mean, inexperienced as a unit. In individual games you guys will challenge them, as we saw a few days ago, but over the course of a season I see you guys dropping a few points here and there that you should be picking up. That's what I mean by inexperience. That's why Udinese always goes to CL, not because they are the most talented team every year but because they have one of the most experienced team/coach every year. They take all the points they can get.
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dhunt2402


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

teamorange wrote:
dhunt2402 wrote:
teamorange wrote:
I still think you guys are a bit too young and inexperienced to be viewed as title contenders. You guys will be at the top but I can only really see Juventus winning Serie A this year.


They will, the race is really for second/third (and even second I think is Napoli's to lose, but they always have a significant lull in their season). Too small a sample size to determine how we'll handle a full season, but there's nothing inexperienced about the players, especially when Aquilani and El Hamdaoui return. Inexperienced as a unit perhaps, but they're already playing phenomenally well together (especially the midfield). A lot remains to be seen, but can't help but be incredibly optimistic after playing the consensus best team in Italy off the pitch.


That's what I mean, inexperienced as a unit. In individual games you guys will challenge them, as we saw a few days ago, but over the course of a season I see you guys dropping a few points here and there that you should be picking up. That's what I mean by inexperience. That's why Udinese always goes to CL, not because they are the most talented team every year but because they have one of the most experienced team/coach every year. They take all the points they can get.


Udinese is actually a bit of an anomaly in that sense. They're the selling team that consistently rebuilds on the fly and still has success. In the last couple of years, their entire team aside from Guidolin and Di Natale is basically different. Since Summer 2011, they've lost Gokhan Inler, Simone Pepe, Alexis Sanchez, Cristian Zapata, Kwadwo Asamoah, Mauricio Isla, and Samir Handanovic. Its nuts, but every year they somehow pull it off, so hopefully Fiorentina can copy that model of adjusting on the fly (just not selling everyone at the end of the season Smile)
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yankee0724


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dhunt2402 wrote:
teamorange wrote:
dhunt2402 wrote:
teamorange wrote:
I still think you guys are a bit too young and inexperienced to be viewed as title contenders. You guys will be at the top but I can only really see Juventus winning Serie A this year.


They will, the race is really for second/third (and even second I think is Napoli's to lose, but they always have a significant lull in their season). Too small a sample size to determine how we'll handle a full season, but there's nothing inexperienced about the players, especially when Aquilani and El Hamdaoui return. Inexperienced as a unit perhaps, but they're already playing phenomenally well together (especially the midfield). A lot remains to be seen, but can't help but be incredibly optimistic after playing the consensus best team in Italy off the pitch.


That's what I mean, inexperienced as a unit. In individual games you guys will challenge them, as we saw a few days ago, but over the course of a season I see you guys dropping a few points here and there that you should be picking up. That's what I mean by inexperience. That's why Udinese always goes to CL, not because they are the most talented team every year but because they have one of the most experienced team/coach every year. They take all the points they can get.


Udinese is actually a bit of an anomaly in that sense. They're the selling team that consistently rebuilds on the fly and still has success. In the last couple of years, their entire team aside from Guidolin and Di Natale is basically different. Since Summer 2011, they've lost Gokhan Inler, Simone Pepe, Alexis Sanchez, Cristian Zapata, Kwadwo Asamoah, Mauricio Isla, and Samir Handanovic. Its nuts, but every year they somehow pull it off, so hopefully Fiorentina can copy that model of adjusting on the fly (just not selling everyone at the end of the season Smile)


Aww...I wanted to point out Udinese's selling habit.
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also, yankee.. you usually have pretty good taste in things

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teamorange


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dhunt2402 wrote:


Udinese is actually a bit of an anomaly in that sense. They're the selling team that consistently rebuilds on the fly and still has success. In the last couple of years, their entire team aside from Guidolin and Di Natale is basically different. Since Summer 2011, they've lost Gokhan Inler, Simone Pepe, Alexis Sanchez, Cristian Zapata, Kwadwo Asamoah, Mauricio Isla, and Samir Handanovic. Its nuts, but every year they somehow pull it off, so hopefully Fiorentina can copy that model of adjusting on the fly (just not selling everyone at the end of the season Smile)


Exactly, there is sort of a aura in the Udinese clubhouse that the players know, they know what to do and how to stay focus even though they keep losing their talent. How many players in the Fiorentina squad been apart of a league winning squad or have a CL cap? Aquilani, Pizarro, Valero, Luca Toni? Maybe one or two other I forgot. Did Montella win anything as a player? You guys do have the quality to compete with Juventus but I except there will be a lull in the season where you drop enough points that a more veteran team wouldn't
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yankee0724


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty sure Fernandez does his first season with Sporting, Gonzalo Rodriguez with Villarreal, El Hamdaoui, Llajic with Partizan too.

What does Montella's success as a player have to do with his abilities as a manager?
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UofMfan909 wrote:
also, yankee.. you usually have pretty good taste in things

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teamorange


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yankee0724 wrote:
Pretty sure Fernandez does his first season with Sporting, Gonzalo Rodriguez with Villarreal, El Hamdaoui, Llajic with Partizan too.

What does Montella's success as a player have to do with his abilities as a manager?


Forgot about Rodriguez (and tbh I don't know much about him other than he came from Real with Valero) and I meant to say top flight (aka Germany, Italy, England Spain). And what I meant by Montella is there is a culture of winning and how to conduct yourself as a player or a coach. These things can transpire from one to another (and I looked it up he was on the 01 Roma team). The season is long and if you aren't "in the hunt" you might lose focus, if you have been apart of a winning atmosphere you know what you have to do.
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deeluxx3


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calling Juve merda, regardless of rivalry, is a bit ambitious given the fact that they are historically greater than Fiorentina and haven't lost in what...45 Serie A games?
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Purple-Pride07


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a Juventus fan, the only teams that truly scare me this term are Fiorentina (and that was before our 0-0 match) and Napoli. Both teams are class and aren't laboring through a flux at the moment.
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ArodFanboy


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

7 games in, 7 points. As a supporter of Milan since I was a young kid, I am disgraced with this team. It's not even about us lacking star power now. The team isn't playing with much if any passion at all. Abbiati is having a horrid start to the year, and the defense isn't helping him at all. Dainele Bonera is not starting quality.Phillippe Mexes isn't a horrible starter if he plays next to a very good CB, but when he's expected to be the man defensively his deficient side shines through. Mario Yepes should not be playing for a club the quality of Milan anymore. Very good player in his time, but this club deserves better getting significant minutes at this stage. Ignazio Abate is the one player on our backline I can say I'm happy with. Mattia De Sciglio is an intriguing prospect but often times gets caught moving way too far forward. In the midfield, Boateng, Emmanuelson, and De Jong are the only players I feel are Milan quality.Ricardo Montolivo is an absolute disgrace moving forward and just not skillful enough defensively to make up for it. Traore looked good early on but has fizzled out and sees almost no minutes now. Flamini has always been extremely meh. Nocerino isn't worth his stamina to me.Just to mediocre to justify giving him significant time. I honestly would love to see more of Sulley Muntari. He loves this club and will give his all, which is more then I can say for many players on this team right now. Our attack just lacks creativity. El Shaarawy has been pretty good, but he's pretty much the only one. Pazzini had a great game against Bologna but hasn't done much of anything since. I'm not even sure if Pato and Robinho are still alive. Haven't seen either so far. (and this is coming from someone who obviously supports both very strongly) I'm very happy Ibrahimovic has come out and said he would like to return to Milan one day. At age 31, I hope it happens sooner rather then later if it does.

Overall, this organization, fanbase, and city deserve better. Inter are clearly the better squad right now and this club has never just laid down and accepted that. I hope they don't start now. An overhaul is needed. Literally every aspect of this team deserves improvement. From goalkeeping, to defending, to midfield play, to attack, it's all just humiliating for a club with this type of tradition. I want to support Allegri (our manager to those who don't know), but this team lacks heart right now. They lack determination and they almost seem content with this mediocrity.

I hope new ownership comes fast. Many quality strikers will be shopped around in January as well as after the season. Same goes for young GKs and defenders. I really,really hope Balotelli continues to underwhelm and upset Mancini at City. I'd love to see him in a Milan shirt. I think he'd be a great player for us here. I'd prefer Dzeko, but I doubt City would move him now. It's becoming very clear that he is a key piece for them. Tevez also seems to be back in favor with Mancini. Angelo Ogbonna would be a great purchase if we can get him from Torino. Youth is needed at CB, Ogbonna offers that and some upside this team lacks defensively. I won't touch on anyone at GK I'd like, because my preference would be Ter Stegen but realistically that's never going to happen. I wish we would have targeted Lloris. Especially at the price tag he we went for.

Any other fans of Serie A on this board, I would love for some of your opinions on what is going wrong and how we can improve this situation. I've never felt like this team was doomed up until now. When you don't have a household name on the squad, lesser names need to step up and perform. Not only is that not happening, but almost everybody is underwhelming right now.
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dhunt2402


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah the big problem was that Berlusconi et al. didn't have a plan for how to replace the two best players in Serie A. If that plan was Montolivo, I have to laugh, he was an absolute disgrace for Fiorentina for the last few seasons, any viola tifoso could have told them that (not that we would, but still Smile)

I really think the problem stemmed from a lack of planning. You can't blame Milan for taking those deals for Ibra and Thiago simply because they were too good to turn down. But you have to be ready for it, you have to plan ahead and say if a PSG comes in and offers us a fortune and takes a load off our wage bill, we have to be ready to sign Fernando Llorente and Ogbonna to replace them! And for heavens sake, the scouts need to watch the players they recommend to sign! One look at Riccardo in action last year would tell you he belongs in Serie B.

I think if you have that plan in place, you're able to placate Cassano to the point where you don't have to swap him for the overrated Pazzini. Tough to foresee Abbiati sucking, but they have to be looking for his replacement sooner than later, he's getting up there anyways. Just poor all around, and they're going to have to spend and spend wisely to get out of this hole.
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ArodFanboy


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dhunt2402 wrote:
Yeah the big problem was that Berlusconi et al. didn't have a plan for how to replace the two best players in Serie A. If that plan was Montolivo, I have to laugh, he was an absolute disgrace for Fiorentina for the last few seasons, any viola tifoso could have told them that (not that we would, but still Smile)

I really think the problem stemmed from a lack of planning. You can't blame Milan for taking those deals for Ibra and Thiago simply because they were too good to turn down. But you have to be ready for it, you have to plan ahead and say if a PSG comes in and offers us a fortune and takes a load off our wage bill, we have to be ready to sign Fernando Llorente and Ogbonna to replace them! And for heavens sake, the scouts need to watch the players they recommend to sign! One look at Riccardo in action last year would tell you he belongs in Serie B.

I think if you have that plan in place, you're able to placate Cassano to the point where you don't have to swap him for the overrated Pazzini. Tough to foresee Abbiati sucking, but they have to be looking for his replacement sooner than later, he's getting up there anyways. Just poor all around, and they're going to have to spend and spend wisely to get out of this hole.


Thanks for the reply,always enjoyed your input especially in this forum. What players in particular would you feel are good fits for Milan that we should go after? I have my own ideas (listed a few), but I feel so drained after getting literally no one noteworthy after selling our two best players. We could use quality from top to bottom, as sad as that sounds.
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dhunt2402


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArodFanboy wrote:
dhunt2402 wrote:
Yeah the big problem was that Berlusconi et al. didn't have a plan for how to replace the two best players in Serie A. If that plan was Montolivo, I have to laugh, he was an absolute disgrace for Fiorentina for the last few seasons, any viola tifoso could have told them that (not that we would, but still Smile)

I really think the problem stemmed from a lack of planning. You can't blame Milan for taking those deals for Ibra and Thiago simply because they were too good to turn down. But you have to be ready for it, you have to plan ahead and say if a PSG comes in and offers us a fortune and takes a load off our wage bill, we have to be ready to sign Fernando Llorente and Ogbonna to replace them! And for heavens sake, the scouts need to watch the players they recommend to sign! One look at Riccardo in action last year would tell you he belongs in Serie B.

I think if you have that plan in place, you're able to placate Cassano to the point where you don't have to swap him for the overrated Pazzini. Tough to foresee Abbiati sucking, but they have to be looking for his replacement sooner than later, he's getting up there anyways. Just poor all around, and they're going to have to spend and spend wisely to get out of this hole.


Thanks for the reply,always enjoyed your input especially in this forum. What players in particular would you feel are good fits for Milan that we should go after? I have my own ideas (listed a few), but I feel so drained after getting literally no one noteworthy after selling our two best players. We could use quality from top to bottom, as sad as that sounds.


Llorente is the obvious one, he's going to be cheaper than anyone else of that caliber simply because his contract is up in June. Someone like that to play with Pato and Robinho would be perfect. Balotelli might be available, but he won't be cheap and he'll want very high wages. You definitely need a midfield playmaker, letting Pirlo go for free is maybe the worst decision of the last few years, and Montolivo clearly is not the answer. Nuri Sahin would have been a great loan signing for this year, maybe he becomes available next summer on a permanent move, I think he'd prefer Milan to Liverpool, but who knows. Defensively, Ogbonna makes too much sense for it not to happen, I was shocked they didn't sign him in August. Dede from Vasco da Gama has been touted as the next Thiago, I think he'd be a shrewd buy for the back line.

A big part of the problem is that Milan's wage bill, even without Ibra and Thiago, is still the highest in Serie A. Montolivo is making 3.5m euros a season, Pazzini 2.7, Bonera 2, Flamini Muntari and Nocerino 1.5 apiece. Getting rid of dead weight will really help in the long run.
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teamorange


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dhunt2402 wrote:


A big part of the problem is that Milan's wage bill, even without Ibra and Thiago, is still the highest in Serie A. Montolivo is making 3.5m euros a season, Pazzini 2.7, Bonera 2, Flamini Muntari and Nocerino 1.5 apiece. Getting rid of dead weight will really help in the long run.


Ding ding ding. Milan is a mess financially and with the introduction of FFP their old style won't work (have their owners bail them out).

http://swissramble.blogspot.com/2012/05/milan-warning-signs.html

A pretty good article and I suggest you look up the other AC Milan articles.
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