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Eagles_808
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 27814
Location: California
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 Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:06 am Post subject: |
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| buno67 wrote: | | i think it all determines on how he truly implements his offense. I would love to see him succeed so he can open the door for college coaches |
The odds are indeed stacked against him. And not to go full Homer J Simpson, but I truly hope he can prove the overwhelming number of detractors wrong.
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[quote="Leon Sandcastle"]Chip Kelly's system is college material...that stuff doesn't fly in the NFL[/quote] |
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ninerfanwheelz
Joined: 01 Apr 2009
Posts: 12206
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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I hate seeing people compare Chip to Petrino. He's been flaky sure, but Bobby Petrino is a despicable human being. Can't say that about Chip
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| CaliforniaKid7 wrote: | | How does it end? Hopefully it's a guy snake cause girls don't poop. |
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ninerfanwheelz
Joined: 01 Apr 2009
Posts: 12206
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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| carnageehw wrote: | Don't like the fact that he decided to stay at Oregon, then changed his mind.
Seems like a money grab. |
I'm not so sure. It's not really about the money with him. When he came back last year he got raises for his assistants but not himself iirc.
I think it had to do with control over personnel.
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| CaliforniaKid7 wrote: | | How does it end? Hopefully it's a guy snake cause girls don't poop. |
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WhackyPlague
Joined: 25 May 2008
Posts: 5063
Location: Orlando, FL
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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| ninerfanwheelz wrote: | | carnageehw wrote: | Don't like the fact that he decided to stay at Oregon, then changed his mind.
Seems like a money grab. |
I'm not so sure. It's not really about the money with him. When he came back last year he got raises for his assistants but not himself iirc.
I think it had to do with control over personnel. |
Agreed. There may have been some concessions by the Eagles, but I just don't think money was the big issue. It was probably control of some kind, either absolute say on players or free reign on choosing assistants (likely both).
Edit: Kelly just said that control was never an issue..  |
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AnAngryAmerican
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 18709
Location: Loveland, CO
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Meco wrote: | | You're blatantly over looking logical progressions just because you want to be the cool kid bashing Chip Kelly when everyone else is (accurately) noting that this is an intriguing hire. |
Oh there's no doubt Kelly is an intriguing hire. I will be following what he does for the Eagles very closely. I know you're post wasn't directed only at me, at least I hope so, but I'm not "bashing" Chip Kelly "to be a cool kid." What I am doing is pointing out a number of big reasons to be skeptical.
| Meco wrote: | | He's got no NFL coaching experience? Valid point. But if you can coach, you can coach IMO. Obviously this is up for debate and we'll just have to see how it works out. The argument that fails is that he's a "college coach". Soooo many coaches have ripened in the college ranks and had success at the NFL level. I don't really see why a lack of NFL experience is going to sink Chip's ship, it's not like there some magic experience number that decides who succeeds and who fails. I'm sure the Eagles will surround him with smart people, get him up to speed on the rules and sign the best assistants that money can buy. |
Nick Saban can coach. He runs the best college program in the country. His team dominates the SEC, the highest level of competition in college football by a wide margin and has won three national titles in the last four years. He does it all using NFL-like offense, defense and special teams schemes. He did the same, albeit with fewer national titles, at LSU. How did he work out in the NFL?
Almost everyone closely associated with the game - players, coaches, executives, the media - will concede the NFL is a whole different animal than college. Can you name some college coaches who came to the NFL, with little or no NFL experience, and succeeded? The top coaches in the NFL - Belichick, Shanahan, Tomlin, Jim and John Harbaughs, Carrol, McCarthy, Lewis, Reid, Payton, Coughlin, Fisher - all earned their stripes in the NFL. How as the most recent college transplant to the NFL (Greg Shiano) done? It's still early to make a real judgement but his team failed to make the playoffs, finished with a losing record in last place and made headlines for dirty play on kneel downs, for which he was roundly criticized by most other, non-college bred, NFL coaches.
This isn't a guarantee that Kelly, who has absolutely zero NFL experience, will fail simply because others have. He could be the exception to the rule. But it's most certainly a major reason to be skeptical, which was the basis of my original post. History tends to repeat itself.
| Meco wrote: | In 2011 and 2010 they absolutely roasted Stanford's defense to the tune of 105 combined points. They put up 27 points on LSU's NFL Jr defense (top 10). Put up 43 on Cal's defense (top 20). Also put up 45 against Wisconsin (top 15).  |
Very true. But they also lost by a combined score of 194-154 and went 0-5 in those games against Stanford, U$C, Auburn, Ohio State and LSU that I mentioned earlier. His success level against NFL-like teams with fast, big defenses running NFL schemes has been mixed. Sure Oregon won some but they lost some. That's reason to be skeptical as to whether his side-to-side speed offense can work in the NFL.
| Eagles_808 wrote: | | I honestly believe if Chip can hire an OC with past HC experience (like a Billick for example) to also act as assistant HC, he could buck the trend you were eluding to. |
If Kelly is to be successful in the NFL the first thing he needs to do is fill out every single position on his coaching staff with people who have a lot of NFL experience. If he hires his buddies and others folks he knows from the college ranks he will set himself up for failure.
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Eagles_808
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 27814
Location: California
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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From his introductory PC today:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/01/17/chip-kelly-brushes-off-college-to-nfl-transition-football-is-football/
| Quote: | | “Football is football,” Kelly said. “This is football at it’s highest level, but it’s still a game that’s played 11-on-11. It’s about putting together a great coaching staff, having a great organization behind you and having great players. Ultimately, whether it’s high school football, college football or professional football, it’s a personnel-driven operation.” |
https://twitter.com/ZBerm
| Quote: | | Chip Kelly said he just wants to coach. Doesn't want to be GM, doesn't want full control. Will work with the Eagles personnel staff. |
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[quote="Leon Sandcastle"]Chip Kelly's system is college material...that stuff doesn't fly in the NFL[/quote] |
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AnAngryAmerican
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 18709
Location: Loveland, CO
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Chip Kelly wrote: | | “Football is football,” Kelly said. “This is football at it’s highest level, but it’s still a game that’s played 11-on-11. It’s about putting together a great coaching staff, having a great organization behind you and having great players. Ultimately, whether it’s high school football, college football or professional football, it’s a personnel-driven operation.” |
The bolded is very naive. Sure at it's most basic level football is football. But human DNA and house fly DNA is, what, 90% identical? Kelly is in for a real wake-up call if he goes in with the mentality that "football is football."
If I was an Eagles fan, this would concern me. Via ESPN NFC East blogger Dan Graziano:
| Dan Graziano wrote: | There are people around the league who will tell you that Lurie has grown increasingly befuddled in recent years about the way his fan base views the team. A team that has averaged 10 wins a year and made the playoffs in nine of the past 13 seasons has nonetheless engendered strongly negative feelings among its own fan base. Eagles fans grew weary of Reid's aloof public persona and his inability to deliver a championship, as well as what they perceived as complacency by Lurie, because he wouldn't make the change they wanted him to make. Lurie believes he's running one of the best franchises in the league and doesn't like the idea that the fans dislike the team.
So you'd better believe that one of the things on Lurie's mind throughout this process has been the impression the ultimate decision would make among Eagles fans. |
If you start making decisions based on what the fans want, sooner or later you will find yourself sitting with them. Lurie, who I believe is one of the better owners in the NFL, shouldn't be so concerned that his fans are dissatisfied with the team and hire a coach based upon the buzz he will create. Winning championships will make the fans happy, plain and simple. You hire the coach who best helps you win football games in October, not one who will make the fans and loud-mouth sports talk radio shock jocks happy in March.
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Last edited by AnAngryAmerican on Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:30 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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JMG
Joined: 23 Dec 2012
Posts: 3435
Location: Columbia
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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| ninerfanwheelz wrote: | | I hate seeing people compare Chip to Petrino. He's been flaky sure, but Bobby Petrino is a despicable human being. Can't say that about Chip |
Me too. I feel like it's a completely different situation and I am confident Chip will be nothing like Petrino/Saban at the pro-level. |
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Phire
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 52495
Location: #FSU #championchip #2012BirdsHoF #2012GoldStnd #YAKtoseIntolerant #TrollyRangers #Danes #CAVALRY
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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Very impressive press conference, should be a fun rebuilding!
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| theuntouchable wrote: | | Think about this phire. I am the real chow. |
| RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Only for the quick and lucky. |
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Dr. Philly
Joined: 02 Nov 2009
Posts: 45528
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:41 pm Post subject: |
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Liked the PC a lot, can't wait for this era to kick in.
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Eagles_808
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
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Location: California
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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Well AnAngryAmerican, your mind is obviously made up at this point. If he does indeed fail, as you suggest he will, congrats on the correct prediction. But if he does succeed (which will be up for personal interpretation, of course), I hope you are open minded enough to admit you were incorrect.
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[quote="Leon Sandcastle"]Chip Kelly's system is college material...that stuff doesn't fly in the NFL[/quote] |
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JMG
Joined: 23 Dec 2012
Posts: 3435
Location: Columbia
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Eagles_808 wrote: | | Well AnAngryAmerican, your mind is obviously made up at this point. If he does indeed fail, as you suggest he will, congrats on the correct prediction. But if he does succeed (which will be up for personal interpretation, of course), I hope you are open minded enough to admit you were incorrect. |
He sure is AnAngryAmerican as it seems |
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DontTazeMeBro
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 27165
Location: 321
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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Why do the pundits keep saying fix the OL? Do they not know Peters and Kelce missed damn near all season and Herremans a big chunk of it?
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Dr. Philly
Joined: 02 Nov 2009
Posts: 45528
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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| DontTazeMeBro wrote: | | Why do the pundits keep saying fix the OL? Do they not know Peters and Kelce missed damn near all season and Herremans a big chunk of it? |
To be fair, Peters and Todd are over 30 and Peters just tore his Achilles twice. Also doesn't help that we don't have a RG.
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| simonwayne wrote: | | LeBron has done for the NBA what Teen Mom has done for teenage pregnancies |
#JDI |
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Vindicatedxx
Joined: 06 Oct 2012
Posts: 3093
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| Posted: Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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| JMG wrote: | | Eagles_808 wrote: | | Well AnAngryAmerican, your mind is obviously made up at this point. If he does indeed fail, as you suggest he will, congrats on the correct prediction. But if he does succeed (which will be up for personal interpretation, of course), I hope you are open minded enough to admit you were incorrect. |
He sure is AnAngryAmerican as it seems |
He's an American. Do we ever admit we are wrong? Hello no lol |
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