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1st post in a long time...Mock Offseason!
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Nnivolcm


Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 8718
Location: Montana
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

duanegarrison09 wrote:
DrRay11 wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
Sllim Pickens wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
I can't see the Lions treating Vanden Bosch the way you suggest. His cap hit for 2013 is 10.7 million because he reworked it last year to support the team. If they cut him, Lions will still have a 5 million cap hit without his services. I think they will ask him to rework the contract to about 5.7 million and ask him to be a back up this year. That would save us 5 million and a salary amount of .7 million would allow him to play out his career with dignity.


And that would push more salary into future years. He knew what he was doing when he restructured and he knew he would get 5 mil for doing nothing if he is cut. And he should be.


Slim, it would not push anything to future years. I said to re-work his contract to 5.7 million this year and play him as a backup. Better than cutting him and still paying him 5 million. Would get his vast experience as a teacher and backup for .7million.


So he's owed 7 million dollars under contract and just expect him to give that all up? He can get a minimum contract somewhere, I'm sure.


Dr,

If we cut him he gets his bonus of $5.6M and we save $5M salary. The cap hit would be 5.6M. I'm suggesting re-working his contract to 5.7M as a teacher and backup. It allows him to retire with dignity rather than to be cut. We can not afford to carry him at 10.7M........win win.

To simplify:

Option One: Cut him KVB get $5.6M Lions save $5M.

Option Two: Re-work contract KVB gets $5.7M Lions get back-up for an additional .7m.

There will never be a cap hit of 10.7M................aint ever going to happen.


There is still the wasted roster space, and that is a valuable asset by itself. KVB was around to teach last year and we got awful play from our DEs.
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YlionsY


Joined: 28 Apr 2008
Posts: 14656
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nnivolcm wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
DrRay11 wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
Sllim Pickens wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
I can't see the Lions treating Vanden Bosch the way you suggest. His cap hit for 2013 is 10.7 million because he reworked it last year to support the team. If they cut him, Lions will still have a 5 million cap hit without his services. I think they will ask him to rework the contract to about 5.7 million and ask him to be a back up this year. That would save us 5 million and a salary amount of .7 million would allow him to play out his career with dignity.


And that would push more salary into future years. He knew what he was doing when he restructured and he knew he would get 5 mil for doing nothing if he is cut. And he should be.


Slim, it would not push anything to future years. I said to re-work his contract to 5.7 million this year and play him as a backup. Better than cutting him and still paying him 5 million. Would get his vast experience as a teacher and backup for .7million.


So he's owed 7 million dollars under contract and just expect him to give that all up? He can get a minimum contract somewhere, I'm sure.


Dr,

If we cut him he gets his bonus of $5.6M and we save $5M salary. The cap hit would be 5.6M. I'm suggesting re-working his contract to 5.7M as a teacher and backup. It allows him to retire with dignity rather than to be cut. We can not afford to carry him at 10.7M........win win.

To simplify:

Option One: Cut him KVB get $5.6M Lions save $5M.

Option Two: Re-work contract KVB gets $5.7M Lions get back-up for an additional .7m.

There will never be a cap hit of 10.7M................aint ever going to happen.


There is still the wasted roster space, and that is a valuable asset by itself. KVB was around to teach last year and we got awful play from our DEs.


KVB as a player coach. Playing a reserved role allowing our younger DE's to gain experience isn't a bad thing.

I have a feeling that KVB would be okay with playing backup and letting the young guys play.
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AW21


Joined: 09 Jan 2013
Posts: 5
Location: Michigan
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 4:37 pm    Post subject: Re: 1st post in a long time...Mock Offseason! Reply with quote

westwood17 wrote:
Okay I haven't posted in this forum in a few years, time to get back to it! Here is my Mock Offseason for the lions this season.

FA's Re-signed
Chris Houston (4 years, 26 million)
DeAndre Levy (3 years, 7 million)
Louis Delmas (1 year, 2.5 million)
Sammie Lee Hill (3 years, 10 million)
Jason Fox (Original Round Tender, 1.26 million)
Joique Bell (2nd round tender, 1.9 million)
Willie Young (2 years, 4 million)

Cuts
Kyle Vanden Bosch
Peterman
Dominic Raiola

Restructured
Matthew Stafford
Ndamukong Suh
Nate Burleson

Free Agents Signed
I'm only putting the major free agents we would sign

Michael Johnson(DE)
Jarius Byrd(S)

Trades
Titus Young for a 7th round pick
1st pick to San Diego for their 1st, 2nd and 6th round picks

2013 NFL Draft
1st Round: Chance Warmack(OG, Alabama)
Arguably one of the best players in the draft but he falls due to guards not being selected very high very often. With him, Reiff and our 2nd round pick we will have one of the best and youngest offensive lines in the NFL.

2nd round: Barrett Jones (OC, Alabama)
He will pair with his teammate Warmack to take over for Raiola. He isn't too strong but is extremely smart and will be a very solid pick here in the 2nd round.

2nd round: Jonathan Banks (CB, Mississippi State)
This pick will help the Lions match up with guys like Brandon Marshall and Jordy Nelson and will help the lions also move towards the new fad of having bigger guys at CB. Banks is 6'2" and doesn't mind getting physical with a receiver and also doesn't mind coming up in the run game. He should be a value pick here if he's here.

3rd round: Markus Wheaton (WR, Oregon State)
We need another weapon opposite of Calvin, and not just a possession guy. We need a guy who can take the top off of the defense and is a burner. Having Calvin, Wheaton, and Broyles(when he comes back) will help us have a very solid and athletic receiving core.

5th round: Andre Ellington (RB, Clemson)
Ellington is an athlete and will be able to come in and be a guy who can sort of take Best's role in the offense. He is a guy who is better used outside of the tackles and has tremendous speed.

6th round: Micah Hyde (CB, Iowa)
Just another guy to bring in and compete for a spot in the CB rotation

6th round: Brad Wing (P, LSU)
Our punting has sucked for the past few seasons, time to bring in a guy who can actually boom a kick.

2013-2014 Roster
QB-Stafford, Shaun Hill, Moore
RB-Leshoure, Bell, Ellington
WR-Calvin, Wheaton, Broyles, Burleson, M. Thomas
TE-Pettigrew, Scheffler, Hiller

LT-Backus, Fox
LG-Sims
C-Barrett Jones
RG-Chance Warmack
RT-Reilly Reiff

RE-Lawrence Jackson
DT-Ndamukong Suh
DT-Nick Fairley
LE-Michael Johnson

OLB-DeAndre Levy
MLB-Stephen Tulloch
OLB-Travis Lewis, Whitehead

CB-Chris Houston, Chris Greenwood, Micah Hyde
CB-Jonathan Banks, Bill Bentley, Jonte Green
FS-Jarius Byrd, Spievey
SS-Delmas

K-Hanson
P-Wing

What do you guys think? Remember, take it easy on me, it's been a long time (: haha


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westwood17


Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 80
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 7:25 pm    Post subject: Re: 1st post in a long time...Mock Offseason! Reply with quote

AW21 wrote:
westwood17 wrote:
Okay I haven't posted in this forum in a few years, time to get back to it! Here is my Mock Offseason for the lions this season.

FA's Re-signed
Chris Houston (4 years, 26 million)
DeAndre Levy (3 years, 7 million)
Louis Delmas (1 year, 2.5 million)
Sammie Lee Hill (3 years, 10 million)
Jason Fox (Original Round Tender, 1.26 million)
Joique Bell (2nd round tender, 1.9 million)
Willie Young (2 years, 4 million)

Cuts
Kyle Vanden Bosch
Peterman
Dominic Raiola

Restructured
Matthew Stafford
Ndamukong Suh
Nate Burleson

Free Agents Signed
I'm only putting the major free agents we would sign

Michael Johnson(DE)
Jarius Byrd(S)

Trades
Titus Young for a 7th round pick
1st pick to San Diego for their 1st, 2nd and 6th round picks

2013 NFL Draft
1st Round: Chance Warmack(OG, Alabama)
Arguably one of the best players in the draft but he falls due to guards not being selected very high very often. With him, Reiff and our 2nd round pick we will have one of the best and youngest offensive lines in the NFL.

2nd round: Barrett Jones (OC, Alabama)
He will pair with his teammate Warmack to take over for Raiola. He isn't too strong but is extremely smart and will be a very solid pick here in the 2nd round.

2nd round: Jonathan Banks (CB, Mississippi State)
This pick will help the Lions match up with guys like Brandon Marshall and Jordy Nelson and will help the lions also move towards the new fad of having bigger guys at CB. Banks is 6'2" and doesn't mind getting physical with a receiver and also doesn't mind coming up in the run game. He should be a value pick here if he's here.

3rd round: Markus Wheaton (WR, Oregon State)
We need another weapon opposite of Calvin, and not just a possession guy. We need a guy who can take the top off of the defense and is a burner. Having Calvin, Wheaton, and Broyles(when he comes back) will help us have a very solid and athletic receiving core.

5th round: Andre Ellington (RB, Clemson)
Ellington is an athlete and will be able to come in and be a guy who can sort of take Best's role in the offense. He is a guy who is better used outside of the tackles and has tremendous speed.

6th round: Micah Hyde (CB, Iowa)
Just another guy to bring in and compete for a spot in the CB rotation

6th round: Brad Wing (P, LSU)
Our punting has sucked for the past few seasons, time to bring in a guy who can actually boom a kick.

2013-2014 Roster
QB-Stafford, Shaun Hill, Moore
RB-Leshoure, Bell, Ellington
WR-Calvin, Wheaton, Broyles, Burleson, M. Thomas
TE-Pettigrew, Scheffler, Hiller

LT-Backus, Fox
LG-Sims
C-Barrett Jones
RG-Chance Warmack
RT-Reilly Reiff

RE-Lawrence Jackson
DT-Ndamukong Suh
DT-Nick Fairley
LE-Michael Johnson

OLB-DeAndre Levy
MLB-Stephen Tulloch
OLB-Travis Lewis, Whitehead

CB-Chris Houston, Chris Greenwood, Micah Hyde
CB-Jonathan Banks, Bill Bentley, Jonte Green
FS-Jarius Byrd, Spievey
SS-Delmas

K-Hanson
P-Wing

What do you guys think? Remember, take it easy on me, it's been a long time (: haha


I love you?


And I love you?
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diehardlionfan


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
Posts: 25888
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YlionsY wrote:
Nnivolcm wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
DrRay11 wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
Sllim Pickens wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
I can't see the Lions treating Vanden Bosch the way you suggest. His cap hit for 2013 is 10.7 million because he reworked it last year to support the team. If they cut him, Lions will still have a 5 million cap hit without his services. I think they will ask him to rework the contract to about 5.7 million and ask him to be a back up this year. That would save us 5 million and a salary amount of .7 million would allow him to play out his career with dignity.


And that would push more salary into future years. He knew what he was doing when he restructured and he knew he would get 5 mil for doing nothing if he is cut. And he should be.


Slim, it would not push anything to future years. I said to re-work his contract to 5.7 million this year and play him as a backup. Better than cutting him and still paying him 5 million. Would get his vast experience as a teacher and backup for .7million.


So he's owed 7 million dollars under contract and just expect him to give that all up? He can get a minimum contract somewhere, I'm sure.


Dr,

If we cut him he gets his bonus of $5.6M and we save $5M salary. The cap hit would be 5.6M. I'm suggesting re-working his contract to 5.7M as a teacher and backup. It allows him to retire with dignity rather than to be cut. We can not afford to carry him at 10.7M........win win.

To simplify:

Option One: Cut him KVB get $5.6M Lions save $5M.

Option Two: Re-work contract KVB gets $5.7M Lions get back-up for an additional .7m.

There will never be a cap hit of 10.7M................aint ever going to happen.


There is still the wasted roster space, and that is a valuable asset by itself. KVB was around to teach last year and we got awful play from our DEs.


KVB as a player coach. Playing a reserved role allowing our younger DE's to gain experience isn't a bad thing.

I have a feeling that KVB would be okay with playing backup and letting the young guys play.


I hadn't thought of that idea but I love it.

We're frustrated by KVB losing a step but as a backup he would be an asset. While he play has regressed due to age his attitude and effort is still there.

Everything he brings is an asset to the organization and he's the type of player you want to see succeed.

Unfortunately I haven't seen much evidence of the teams desire to think outside the box.
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DrRay11


Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 3355
Location: Chicago, IL
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd bring KVB back but the only way is to cut him and sign him back at the minimum. There's no way he just gives up 4 million of his salary and 2 million dollar bonus. If we restructure, the best we are going to do is push 2/3 of that salary to later years, making it even more pain in 2014/15
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Sllim Pickens


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KVB can't give that money up. If we rework it this year, that would add 5mil to be extended over the rest of his contract as signing bonus money on top of the bonus money he has allready moved to future years. In fact he has allready been paid that and would still count for money on our cap in future years if he retires. If we work him down this year it would only add more to dead cap in the future.

I agree with DrRay, cut him and bring him back at the minimum. Get his big signing bonus off the books for future years. Or just tell him to retire and hire him as a D Line coach. KVB was a solid addition early, but I don't think he offers much on or off the field that others can't replace.
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duanegarrison09


Joined: 11 Nov 2010
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Location: Macomb County, Michigan
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dr. Ray and Slim,

You guys don't get it........maybe diehardlionfan can explain it.
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DrRay11


Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 3355
Location: Chicago, IL
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

duanegarrison09 wrote:
Dr. Ray and Slim,

You guys don't get it........maybe diehardlionfan can explain it.


No, I get it.

He is due 5 million dollars salary this year and a 2 million dollar roster bonus. He has a cap pro-ration of 3.68 million from a previous signing bonus which he will not "earn" this year - it's already been earned in the past. We can avoid the seven total million dollars he is owed, but that accelerates bonus prorations of 1 million each in 2014 and 2015 to 2013, thus the 5.7m dollar cap penalty we get by cutting him. We still end up saving 5 million this year.

The other option is to restructure, which would mean moving 4 million of his salary to a bonus this year. Then, his cap hit becomes about 6 million this year, but his 2014/2015 cap hits become about 11 million each. That's really all I can do to explain.

The third option is ior him to take a massive paycut for no real reason, which he just won't do.

Read about the essentials of an NFL contract here:
http://www.thefootballeducator.com/the-basic-biology-of-nfl-contract-negotiations-101/
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Sllim Pickens


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DrRay11 wrote:
duanegarrison09 wrote:
Dr. Ray and Slim,

You guys don't get it........maybe diehardlionfan can explain it.


No, I get it.

He is due 5 million dollars salary this year and a 2 million dollar roster bonus. He has a cap pro-ration of 3.68 million from a previous signing bonus which he will not "earn" this year - it's already been earned in the past. We can avoid the seven total million dollars he is owed, but that accelerates bonus prorations of 1 million each in 2014 and 2015 to 2013, thus the 5.7m dollar cap penalty we get by cutting him. We still end up saving 5 million this year.

The other option is to restructure, which would mean moving 4 million of his salary to a bonus this year. Then, his cap hit becomes about 6 million this year, but his 2014/2015 cap hits become about 11 million each. That's really all I can do to explain.

The third option is ior him to take a massive paycut for no real reason, which he just won't do.

Read about the essentials of an NFL contract here:
http://www.thefootballeducator.com/the-basic-biology-of-nfl-contract-negotiations-101/


Exactly, the NFLPA won't allow players to just give up money. If we work down his cap, it will turn into guaranteed bonus money. There is no sneaking out of his cap. It will either hit us this year or in future years wether he plays, is cut, or retires.
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LionsChamps201?


Joined: 03 Jan 2010
Posts: 374
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like it a lot. Its basically what I had in mine. I just hope we can steal Byrd away
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