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The Alex Smith trade rumors thread....
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48 1/2ers


Joined: 01 Aug 2011
Posts: 2418
Location: UCI
PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

49ers Finest wrote:
48 1/2ers wrote:
EverythingSF wrote:
48 1/2ers wrote:
I really dont want to waste my time explaining to you why Alex isn't better than those guys because clearly you have this image in your mind of Alex as a guy who never makes mistakes and is more clutch than Tom Brady...


Yes, because that is exactly what I said.

Rather than prove me wrong about Alex, how about you prove me wrong about Newton, Stafford, and Ryan being clutch? Flacco I will give to you because he has been clutch, I just still like Alex more.

Or perhaps you could just realize that I am simply making the point that I look for different characteristics in a QB than most others do. You like Dan Marino style of football, I like Joe Montana's...


dude this isnt a comparison of Montana vs Marino. And this term you call clutch...when did you happen to discover that Alex has it? In his 7th year? If you really want an unbiased opinion put this in the Comparison Thread.

Oh and that little shot saying that Alex would have won us the game sunday since he's so efficient in the redzone...have you forgot that we had one of the worst redzone touchdown efficiencies in the league last year?

say whatever you want but I promise you that you wont find 3 people on this entire forum that will agree with you.

agree with what exactly?
right now id take alex over cam stafford and probably flacco (this dude will come back once again. few months ago people were talking about what they would do with him)
i like ryan and think hes underrated.

That a franchise is better off with the Alex Smith as their QB than Cam, Flacco, Stafford, and Ryan....
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TidesHaveTurned


Joined: 26 Jan 2013
Posts: 17
PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

49ers Finest wrote:
TidesHaveTurned wrote:
Is he even going to beat out Matt Cassell? It's going to be pretty funny watching the guy holding a clipboard next year. His fans will probably blame the coaching again, lmao.

Wait is this serious?
Is Blaine gabbert better than Alex too? Laughing
Shux Alex could probably be the third string behind cassel and Quinn!

If Alex goes to kc, I would bet they go 500 or better


This is the same guy who got beat out by the likes of Tim Rattay, JTO, Shaun Hill, tug and forth with Troy Smith, etc....

It would not surprise me one bit if Cassell beat out Alex Smith.
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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 3:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TidesHaveTurned wrote:


This is the same guy who got beat out by the likes of Tim Rattay, JTO, Shaun Hill, tug and forth with Troy Smith, etc....

It would not surprise me one bit if Cassell beat out Alex Smith.


Ordinarily, I'd give little but an emoticon... but in certain contexts, that is frowned upon. So instead? I'll say... great to have you here! Thanks for joining FF and being a part of our FF family. Smile
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EverythingSF


Joined: 15 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
TidesHaveTurned wrote:


This is the same guy who got beat out by the likes of Tim Rattay, JTO, Shaun Hill, tug and forth with Troy Smith, etc....

It would not surprise me one bit if Cassell beat out Alex Smith.


Ordinarily, I'd give little but an emoticon... but in certain contexts, that is frowned upon. So instead? I'll say... great to have you here! Thanks for joining FF and being a part of our FF family. Smile


Laughing I second that welcoming.

48 1/2ers wrote:
dude this isnt a comparison of Montana vs Marino. And this term you call clutch...when did you happen to discover that Alex has it? In his 7th year? If you really want an unbiased opinion put this in the Comparison Thread.

Oh and that little shot saying that Alex would have won us the game sunday since he's so efficient in the redzone...have you forgot that we had one of the worst redzone touchdown efficiencies in the league last year?

say whatever you want but I promise you that you wont find 3 people on this entire forum that will agree with you.


First off, I do not why you are getting so worked up over all of this. We are both expressing our opinions, no reason to go nuts about it.

As for my Montana vs Marino comparison, I was simply stating that I care more about the little things a QB does in getting his team the win. You seem to be with the majority of football fans that look for and need big time stats in QB comparisons. Am I wrong in that assumption?

And I am not sure how that was "a little shot"? All I was saying is that I believe Alex would have gotten it done. I do not see how it is a shot at (I assuming you meant) Kaep when I have said multiple times on this forum that Kaep deserved to be starting.

And no I have not forgot that, but it seems that you have forgotten the Bengals, Eagles, Lions, and Saints games last year. It also seems that you forgotten that we never installed our full playbook last year since our coaches had less than a month to put one in. But even more so it seems that you have completely forgotten that the season before last, Alex lead the entire league in redzone efficiency.

Say whatever you want to say and I do not care if people do not agree with me. I could not find 3 people to agree with me that the 49ers would make the playoffs in Harbaugh's first year, not even on the Niner forum. I could not find many to agree with me that Alex could be highly successful if given a competent coach.

So continue to disagree with me on Alex, but lets be honest here, over the past few years I think Alex has proven those of us who believe in him to be right more so than those who doubt him......even though us Alex lovers were told back then that "the comparison thread" would prove us wrong
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EverythingSF wrote:
Boltstrikes wrote:

Alex's Mom?

Alex's High School Backup? Wink
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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EverythingSF wrote:


I have strong opinions on this... but I have no choice but to keep them to myself.. as if they could be contorted into or away from my actual beliefs.. but you know... and I know.. what's up.

Have SO much more to say.. but am constricted... so I'll say this... I DO believe that Kaep can be amazing... and I sure hope that he will be. I don't mean just always... I mean.. clutch when it matters... but now I am tired and drunk... so whateverz.... that's it for me...

I got NO problem with Kaep... still think Jim is a............ oops.. remember where I am.. done.
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EverythingSF


Joined: 15 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 4:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
EverythingSF wrote:


I have strong opinions on this... but I have no choice but to keep them to myself.. as if they could be contorted into or away from my actual beliefs.. but you know... and I know.. what's up.

Have SO much more to say.. but am constricted... so I'll say this... I DO believe that Kaep can be amazing... and I sure hope that he will be. I don't mean just always... I mean.. clutch when it matters... but now I am tired and drunk... so whateverz.... that's it for me...

I got NO problem with Kaep... still think Jim is a............ oops.. remember where I am.. done.


Yeah I gotcha. I believe Kaep's ceiling is much higher, honestly I think Kaep has the ability to do things we have never seen at the QB position. The only thing stopping him from that now is his experience and the mental aspect of being a QB IMO.

Too many people get caught up with passing yards and big plays in the NFL just as too many people get caught up with homeruns in baseball. That is why I love my Giant's, they do not care to hit homeruns, in fact they had the least in the league last year. They know they are a team built on pitching and they do everything to compliment that. Just as the Niners were a team built on defense and I feel Alex complimented that perfectly, Kaep has the bigger play ability and the flash no doubt, but with that it becomes a bit tougher on the defense....at least for the time being. Kaep faced 3 above average defenses and lost to all 3 of them. He definitely improved and will continue to. I think if he was more experienced he would of won that game for us. And I am fully backing the guy, but must admit there will always be a part of me that wishes I could know how the season would have turned out if Alex never got hurt.

***Again for those of you that will go crazy about this, I have clearly stated staying with Kaep was the right decision***
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EverythingSF wrote:
Boltstrikes wrote:

Alex's Mom?

Alex's High School Backup? Wink
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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EverythingSF wrote:

***Again for those of you that will go crazy about this, I have clearly stated staying with Kaep was the right decision***


Well that's good on you.. but I'm old and just don't care...I think it was completely the wrong decision. I think ring 6 was ours if Jim didn't rush to get "his boy" out there. I know, I know.. "blah blah blah" "no way Alex can do this, that, and the other.." Blah... sometimes experience beats youth.. I know Kaep has amazing things that Alex just doesn't... but the intangibles... oh but the intangibles.. whatever.. all just speculation and bias at play. I am not the least bit surprised that things turned out the way they did... where even "Kaep-lovers" are saying... "hey, he's only been a 10 game starter... and how good he is already!"

Yeah... he is... yeah... he is.. and how's that ring not fitting? hmm? Sad
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SoCalNiner


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EverythingSF wrote:
Yeah I gotcha. I believe Kaep's ceiling is much higher, honestly I think Kaep has the ability to do things we have never seen at the QB position. The only thing stopping him from that now is his experience and the mental aspect of being a QB IMO.

Too many people get caught up with passing yards and big plays in the NFL just as too many people get caught up with homeruns in baseball. That is why I love my Giant's, they do not care to hit homeruns, in fact they had the least in the league last year. They know they are a team built on pitching and they do everything to compliment that. Just as the Niners were a team built on defense and I feel Alex complimented that perfectly, Kaep has the bigger play ability and the flash no doubt, but with that it becomes a bit tougher on the defense....at least for the time being. Kaep faced 3 above average defenses and lost to all 3 of them. He definitely improved and will continue to. I think if he was more experienced he would of won that game for us. And I am fully backing the guy, but must admit there will always be a part of me that wishes I could know how the season would have turned out if Alex never got hurt.

***Again for those of you that will go crazy about this, I have clearly stated staying with Kaep was the right decision***


Kaep faced three above average defenses and scored an average of 34 points a game on them. I'm not seeing the problem there. Our defense is to blame for not holding their own. We used to be a team that only needed around 24 points to win, yet our defense is having trouble keeping teams under 30. Injuries to the Smith bros really hurt us in the playoffs, and had our defense played the way they normally do, then I'm sure we'd be hoisting our 6th Lombardi.

The team when Alex was at the helm is not the same as it is now. We're more open and dynamic, and it's what Harbaugh wanted to run all along. I for one and pretty excited about what this offense can be under an off-season.

People can question the move to Kaep all they want, but the move was ballsy and paid off. Could Alex have overcame that 17 point deficit against the Falcons? Sure, but we know one thing, Kaep DID overcome that deficit. That showed he was ready for big stages, and that he was capable of coming back from behind.
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cHaInBrEaKeRiii


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Man, some of you Alex guys need to let it go. Whatever happened, happened. Everyone else except some bitter Smith fans are praising Kap's play and the move that Harbaugh made. I cant disagree w them when Kap took us to the SB and almost to the final play despite our defensive struggles. To say that Alex woulda won it and Kap is not clutch is pretty ridiculous. If you guys truly appreciate Kap, get behind him and let this Alex woulda done better or he's more clutch than Kap things go.
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rudyZ


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cHaInBrEaKeRiii wrote:
Man, some of you Alex guys need to let it go. Whatever happened, happened. Everyone else except some bitter Smith fans are praising Kap's play and the move that Harbaugh made. I cant disagree w them when Kap took us to the SB and almost to the final play despite our defensive struggles. To say that Alex woulda won it and Kap is not clutch is pretty ridiculous. If you guys truly appreciate Kap, get behind him and let this Alex woulda done better or he's more clutch than Kap things go.



I do think most Alex fans are praising Kap too. These discussions aren't about downplaying Kap so much as they are about the general assumption that Alex is undervalued. Alex had more than his fair share to do with the successes of this team these last two years, yet he gets very little credit, and even Harbaugh gets more credit than Alex for what Alex was doing on the field. I guess we will see next year if it was all Harbaugh.

And someone said something about the Alex having only to score 24 points to win because the defense was playing better. Well, if you do not think QB play has an impact on the defense performance, then you should check again. When Kap has been wildly inefficient, opponents have scored in bunches on us. Even in his bad games (excluding the Giants game, where he was wildly inefficient from beginning to end), Alex was still efficient enough to give the defense a chance. Alex deserves credit for his play, and so does Kap. But let's not act like Kap is the most well-rounded QB in the league and has nothing more to learn. As he grows, he should be a great QB. But that doesn't diminish what Alex is.

So, anyone wants to bet who will be the first to start an Alex thread next season? An Alex lover or a hater? On his first loss (on an arguably bad team, mind you), I guess a hater will come in and say that he sucks.. then a discussion will follow, and a number of Alexcuses will be thrown (supported with stats, mind you), and bla bla bla. Where does the negativity always come from? From lovers or haters? I do wonder...
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cHaInBrEaKeRiii


Joined: 21 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@RudyZ No one is discrediting Alex and no none is acting Kap is the most well rounded QB around. It is what it is. Alex got hurt .. Kap came and took us to the SB... Lol, you guys talk like Alex is the second coming of Jesus. Lets face it, Kap already is a better QB than Smith.

About your comment about who will make the first comment about Smith next year.... Idk but hey if it looks like a rat and smells like a rat... It prolly is a rat.
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steadypimpin


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Last year we had our defense playing elite ball. They led the league in turnovers putting this offense in great field position. Akers also led the league in FGs made. Many said that was an anomaly and that our team would fall off a bit. Alex benefited from last years defense and special teams. I think our defense also was one that had the most sacks or was right up there. That's why people are saying Alex had the perfect situation. Everyone talks about his 4th qucomebacks last year but never talks about why Alex got to get thise comebacks. If our defense wasn't so good he wouldn't be in those positions last year. A lot of times he got to have those comebacks because our defense got a crucial turnover and gave him awesome field position. I wonder how well he would have done last year if our defense played like they did this year and how well Alex would have done if Akers missed so many fgs last year. Alex had the perfect situation and was still an average QB. Teams notice that stuff and that's why most of us doubt they'll give us anything high draft pick wise for him.
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rudyZ


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

steadypimpin wrote:
Last year we had our defense playing elite ball. They led the league in turnovers putting this offense in great field position. Akers also led the league in FGs made. Many said that was an anomaly and that our team would fall off a bit. Alex benefited from last years defense and special teams. I think our defense also was one that had the most sacks or was right up there. That's why people are saying Alex had the perfect situation. Everyone talks about his 4th qucomebacks last year but never talks about why Alex got to get thise comebacks. If our defense wasn't so good he wouldn't be in those positions last year. A lot of times he got to have those comebacks because our defense got a crucial turnover and gave him awesome field position. I wonder how well he would have done last year if our defense played like they did this year and how well Alex would have done if Akers missed so many fgs last year. Alex had the perfect situation and was still an average QB. Teams notice that stuff and that's why most of us doubt they'll give us anything high draft pick wise for him.



The mistake in this would be to think his value on the market is tied to how good a player he is. It's not. Value comes from the market itself, not from the quality of the player. That's how Apple was able to sell a smartphone for $700 a few years back, because it was the only one such device on the market, so they could ask for a premium. The market for NFL QBs is much different, and it's the teams that determine the value of players. Alex is arguably the best QB currently on the market (he doesn't have the highest potential, of course, but his current level of play is better than any other tradeable QB, free agent and most likely any rookie in the class). There's very little a signed player can do to increase his value on the trade market. If anything, he shouldn't want to increase his own trade value, as it inherently decreases the value of the team he is traded to. I'm sure Alex would prefer to be traded for a 7th rounder rather than a 2nd, because that second could be better used improving the team. But that's not his call. It's the market that determines his value.

So discussing how average or not he is is really pointless. The debate should be all about which team is so desperately in need of a QB performing at Alex's level to pay up, and how much it will be willing to pay. Desperate enough, sure it could be as high as a second rounder. No team desperate at all, then next to nothing, if not nothing at all. But I'm sure most people's expectations of this is a mid round pick. Some people are daydreaming about a high pick, but that's what we do in the offseason. We all look at the draft order and different mocks and dream this or that player will fall to our spot. I don't see how daydreaming for a second rounder is any different, or how it makes the person mentioning it wrong in any way.
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AnafiWhat


Joined: 11 Jan 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think at the end of the day Smith will be traded. Either to KC or Cleveland, and probably for a 2013 2nd or conditional 2014 1st. Just a hunch, but I think SF makes out good on the deal and will use the return to upgrade the WR corps or help increase the depth on defense, the line in particular.
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J-ALL-DAY


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
EverythingSF wrote:

***Again for those of you that will go crazy about this, I have clearly stated staying with Kaep was the right decision***


Well that's good on you.. but I'm old and just don't care...I think it was completely the wrong decision. I think ring 6 was ours if Jim didn't rush to get "his boy" out there. I know, I know.. "blah blah blah" "no way Alex can do this, that, and the other.." Blah... sometimes experience beats youth.. I know Kaep has amazing things that Alex just doesn't... but the intangibles... oh but the intangibles.. whatever.. all just speculation and bias at play. I am not the least bit surprised that things turned out the way they did... where even "Kaep-lovers" are saying... "hey, he's only been a 10 game starter... and how good he is already!"

Yeah... he is... yeah... he is.. and how's that ring not fitting? hmm? Sad


Kaep had a GREAT game for it being his 10th start, and REGARDLESS of it being his 10th or 100th start, it was a fine game. Let's not please act like it was because of Kaepernick we lost. I hate when people completely disregard Alex Smith, but I doubt he would lead the #1 offense in postseason. He has a certain style and will turn it over less, but does that get us a ring? Who knows, but I don't think so and Kaepernick was the main reason this team got to the Super Bowl. The defense wore down and injuries to the Smith bros were devastating, and the Jacoby Jones TD didn't help either. We have seen Alex make some comebacks, but we have also seen him look completely lost and wanting to quit. In the redzone Smith is absolutely better at this point, but Kaepernick is a guy that doesn't get discouraged like him either. Again, no way to know what would happen with Smith, but I just don't see ANY way he would play better than Kaepernik did in the postseason. Like SoCal stated, we don't know if Smith could come back from a 17-0 or 28-6 deficit, but we DO know Kaepernick can.

I like both QBs, but Harbaugh most definitely made the correct call. I wish Alex all the best and truly hope he proves the haters wrong in his next stop.
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