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x0x
Joined: 10 Jul 2008
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 Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:22 pm Post subject: Charles Woodson Rank? |
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Here's the questions:
1. Where does Woodson rank at CB of his era?
2. Where does he rank in the last 20 years?
3. Where does he rank all-time?
4. Hypothetically, if he had won 3 more titles, where would you rank him above?
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Jakuvious
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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1. Assuming by era you mean the past 10 years or so, I'd have him top five. Behind Bailey, Barber, and Law. Revis might be above him as well if you count him. The position has a lot of guys who just lack the consistency and longevity. Troy Vincent and Aeneus Williams are there if you count them as part of that era. But there are a lot of Sam Madisons, Chris McAllisters, Nnamdi Asomughas, and Asante Samuels, who just weren't great long enough, and a lot of Charles Tillmans and Antoine Winfields who were very good for a long time, but never elite. Woodson is an odd one where he was elite then meh then elite again. The Packer seasons really saved his legacy.
2. Probably top 10, without looking too in depth. Behind the same guys plus a few more from the 1990s.
3. Now, probably top 20, top 25, again without looking into it too deeply. Just kind of hazarding a guess. Woodson had some lackluster years in the middle of his career that a lot of the greats never did. That makes it hard for me to really elevate the guy.
4. No change.
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Last edited by Jakuvious on Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:51 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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TheKillerNacho
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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Easily a Top 5 CB of his era. I think he's in the Top 25 of all time.
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sp6488
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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| TheKillerNacho wrote: | | Easily a Top 5 CB of his era. I think he's in the Top 25 of all time. |
I wouldn't say easily. I think he's great, but I really have to think about it. He's not like a Randy Moss or Tom Brady where he automatically comes to mind and it's no question that he'll be in his era's top 5 before I even consider it.
[Will edit with answers to OP's questions]
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footy_29
Joined: 31 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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Is his era the last 15 seasons? Because if that is the case, it narrowly cuts out Aeneas Williams, Rod Woodson, Deion Sanders and Darrell Green who were reaching the end of their careers, two of which switched to FS toward the end and therefore even harder to rationalize including.
Champ Bailey is WAY ahead, and with a successful return by Revis, I think you need to put him ahead of Charles as well. However, there are few to challenge Charles Woodson during the 2000s. He's certainly one of the most talented cornerbacks to play, but I think there is a pretty good argument from an on-field perspective that Ronde Barber should be in front, and Ty Law is probably right in behind.
Nnamdi probably doesn't make the HoF, so we can essentially write him off. Otherwise, who is there really? There is a fair amount of young top talent right now in Haden, Peterson, and Sherman (off the top of my head) but they are the next generation. All in all, Charles Woodson found himself in a good time period where there was a clear gap in corner talent and he made the stats that count for a corner INTs.
Looking at the HoF and factoring in yet-to-be-inducted players, I would say somewhere in the 16-18 range, but closer to the latter.
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EliteTexan80
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:07 pm Post subject: Re: Charles Woodson Rank? |
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| x0x wrote: | 1. Where does Woodson rank at CB of his era?
2. Where does he rank in the last 20 years?
3. Where does he rank all-time?
4. Hypothetically, if he had won 3 more titles, where would you rank him above? |
...um, you realize there's a Comparisons forum, right?
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seminoles1
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:20 pm Post subject: |
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Barely behind Champ for me. Top 15-20 CB ever.
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CornOnDaCobb
Joined: 16 Jan 2013
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 12:06 am Post subject: |
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| footy_29 wrote: | Is his era the last 15 seasons? Because if that is the case, it narrowly cuts out Aeneas Williams, Rod Woodson, Deion Sanders and Darrell Green who were reaching the end of their careers, two of which switched to FS toward the end and therefore even harder to rationalize including.
Champ Bailey is WAY ahead, and with a successful return by Revis, I think you need to put him ahead of Charles as well. However, there are few to challenge Charles Woodson during the 2000s. He's certainly one of the most talented cornerbacks to play, but I think there is a pretty good argument from an on-field perspective that Ronde Barber should be in front, and Ty Law is probably right in behind.
Nnamdi probably doesn't make the HoF, so we can essentially write him off. Otherwise, who is there really? There is a fair amount of young top talent right now in Haden, Peterson, and Sherman (off the top of my head) but they are the next generation. All in all, Charles Woodson found himself in a good time period where there was a clear gap in corner talent and he made the stats that count for a corner INTs.
Looking at the HoF and factoring in yet-to-be-inducted players, I would say somewhere in the 16-18 range, but closer to the latter. |
Ummm no. Charles is the only one of those guys to win DPOY, and while Bailey was more consistent over his career, I'd say in his prime Woodson was better. Revis has proven to be a lockdown cover corner, which is the most important aspect of being a cb but he doesnt have the ability that Woodson has in being able to be a monster in run support, force turnovers and blitz the qb, so its a matter of preference there. |
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lionslicer
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:09 am Post subject: |
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| sp6488 wrote: | | TheKillerNacho wrote: | | Easily a Top 5 CB of his era. I think he's in the Top 25 of all time. |
I wouldn't say easily. I think he's great, but I really have to think about it. He's not like a Randy Moss or Tom Brady where he automatically comes to mind and it's no question that he'll be in his era's top 5 before I even consider it.
[Will edit with answers to OP's questions] |
So you're saying if someone asked you to name the top 5 cornerbacks who played from 2000 to 2010, Woodson wouldn't come to mind at all?
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Jakuvious
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:21 am Post subject: |
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| lionslicer wrote: | | sp6488 wrote: | | TheKillerNacho wrote: | | Easily a Top 5 CB of his era. I think he's in the Top 25 of all time. |
I wouldn't say easily. I think he's great, but I really have to think about it. He's not like a Randy Moss or Tom Brady where he automatically comes to mind and it's no question that he'll be in his era's top 5 before I even consider it.
[Will edit with answers to OP's questions] |
So you're saying if someone asked you to name the top 5 cornerbacks who played from 2000 to 2010, Woodson wouldn't come to mind at all? |
That's not what he said at all.
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tom cody
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:35 am Post subject: |
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I have him among my top 5 CB's right now and in my top 20 CB's all time.
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footy_29
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:07 am Post subject: |
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| CornOnDaCobb wrote: | | footy_29 wrote: | Is his era the last 15 seasons? Because if that is the case, it narrowly cuts out Aeneas Williams, Rod Woodson, Deion Sanders and Darrell Green who were reaching the end of their careers, two of which switched to FS toward the end and therefore even harder to rationalize including.
Champ Bailey is WAY ahead, and with a successful return by Revis, I think you need to put him ahead of Charles as well. However, there are few to challenge Charles Woodson during the 2000s. He's certainly one of the most talented cornerbacks to play, but I think there is a pretty good argument from an on-field perspective that Ronde Barber should be in front, and Ty Law is probably right in behind.
Nnamdi probably doesn't make the HoF, so we can essentially write him off. Otherwise, who is there really? There is a fair amount of young top talent right now in Haden, Peterson, and Sherman (off the top of my head) but they are the next generation. All in all, Charles Woodson found himself in a good time period where there was a clear gap in corner talent and he made the stats that count for a corner INTs.
Looking at the HoF and factoring in yet-to-be-inducted players, I would say somewhere in the 16-18 range, but closer to the latter. |
Ummm no. Charles is the only one of those guys to win DPOY, and while Bailey was more consistent over his career, I'd say in his prime Woodson was better. Revis has proven to be a lockdown cover corner, which is the most important aspect of being a cb but he doesnt have the ability that Woodson has in being able to be a monster in run support, force turnovers and blitz the qb, so its a matter of preference there. |
And Champ Bailey could have received the DPoY award in 2006, which went to Jason Taylor. Before you repeat the sacks and turnovers, keep in mind that Champ is one of the best tackling corners of his generation.
Charles Woodson was a very good playmaker, and he really came into his own in that nickel corner position in GB under Dom Capers, but when we are talking about players who qualify as shutdown corners, Charles Woodson is not on the same level.
Darrell Green, Deion Sanders, Champ Bailey, Aeneas Williams and Rod Woodson are the top 5 corners of the modern era.
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CornOnDaCobb
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:16 am Post subject: |
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| footy_29 wrote: | | CornOnDaCobb wrote: | | footy_29 wrote: | Is his era the last 15 seasons? Because if that is the case, it narrowly cuts out Aeneas Williams, Rod Woodson, Deion Sanders and Darrell Green who were reaching the end of their careers, two of which switched to FS toward the end and therefore even harder to rationalize including.
Champ Bailey is WAY ahead, and with a successful return by Revis, I think you need to put him ahead of Charles as well. However, there are few to challenge Charles Woodson during the 2000s. He's certainly one of the most talented cornerbacks to play, but I think there is a pretty good argument from an on-field perspective that Ronde Barber should be in front, and Ty Law is probably right in behind.
Nnamdi probably doesn't make the HoF, so we can essentially write him off. Otherwise, who is there really? There is a fair amount of young top talent right now in Haden, Peterson, and Sherman (off the top of my head) but they are the next generation. All in all, Charles Woodson found himself in a good time period where there was a clear gap in corner talent and he made the stats that count for a corner INTs.
Looking at the HoF and factoring in yet-to-be-inducted players, I would say somewhere in the 16-18 range, but closer to the latter. |
Ummm no. Charles is the only one of those guys to win DPOY, and while Bailey was more consistent over his career, I'd say in his prime Woodson was better. Revis has proven to be a lockdown cover corner, which is the most important aspect of being a cb but he doesnt have the ability that Woodson has in being able to be a monster in run support, force turnovers and blitz the qb, so its a matter of preference there. |
And Champ Bailey could have received the DPoY award in 2006, which went to Jason Taylor. Before you repeat the sacks and turnovers, keep in mind that Champ is one of the best tackling corners of his generation.
Charles Woodson was a very good playmaker, and he really came into his own in that nickel corner position in GB under Dom Capers, but when we are talking about players who qualify as shutdown corners, Charles Woodson is not on the same level.
Darrell Green, Deion Sanders, Champ Bailey, Aeneas Williams and Rod Woodson are the top 5 corners of the modern era. |
Could of should of, facts are facts. Its a matter of opinion in all this but one can argue that Woodson had more of an impact than Bailey did. Whats taking away one receiver off the field when you can be like Woodson and be all over the place? Sure Bailey was a better cover guy but Woody was better in every other aspect. I just think in terms of overall versatility I don't know if we will ever see a cornerback that could do it all very well like Woodson did. |
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lionslicer
Joined: 06 Nov 2010
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:24 am Post subject: |
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| Jakuvious wrote: | | lionslicer wrote: | | sp6488 wrote: | | TheKillerNacho wrote: | | Easily a Top 5 CB of his era. I think he's in the Top 25 of all time. |
I wouldn't say easily. I think he's great, but I really have to think about it. He's not like a Randy Moss or Tom Brady where he automatically comes to mind and it's no question that he'll be in his era's top 5 before I even consider it.
[Will edit with answers to OP's questions] |
So you're saying if someone asked you to name the top 5 cornerbacks who played from 2000 to 2010, Woodson wouldn't come to mind at all? |
That's not what he said at all. |
Yeah it kind of is.
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Jakuvious
Joined: 06 Sep 2010
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| Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 11:30 am Post subject: |
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| lionslicer wrote: | | Jakuvious wrote: | | lionslicer wrote: | | sp6488 wrote: | | TheKillerNacho wrote: | | Easily a Top 5 CB of his era. I think he's in the Top 25 of all time. |
I wouldn't say easily. I think he's great, but I really have to think about it. He's not like a Randy Moss or Tom Brady where he automatically comes to mind and it's no question that he'll be in his era's top 5 before I even consider it.
[Will edit with answers to OP's questions] |
So you're saying if someone asked you to name the top 5 cornerbacks who played from 2000 to 2010, Woodson wouldn't come to mind at all? |
That's not what he said at all. |
Yeah it kind of is. |
He said it doesn't automatically and unquestionably come to mind like a Moss or Brady. Not that he wouldn't come to mind at all.
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