Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

Dolphins sign former Bears OG Lance Louis to 1-year deal
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Miami Dolphins
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Billy Spikes


Joined: 12 Jul 2008
Posts: 41344
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

***Update***
Quote:
Lance Louis' one-year Dolphins deal: $1.603 million, $100,000 bonus, $715,000 salary, $763,750 roster bonus, $25,000 workout bonus


https://twitter.com/RavensInsider/status/318730097802743810
_________________
#JDI
Official Roster Cutdowns Thread
All Time Top Ten Safeties Ranking
Tom Brady Tribute
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SUG


Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 6825
Location: Alameda, Ca
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

skatewood2 wrote:
SUG wrote:
skatewood2 wrote:
WaterBear56 wrote:
skatewood2 wrote:
ViolentMonk71 wrote:
Does this signing mean the Dolphins will wait on G in the draft?


I'm not giving up on the idea of Cooper at 12 or trading down to get Cooper later in the 1st.

If they truly believe that Martin can be the LT then they can pick up a RT in the late 2nd or 3rd round.


But they don't believe Martin can be the LT, so we are going LT.


Unfortunately you cannot believe anything being posted this time of year. I hope that we don't go LT in the first and we give Martin a chance to prove if he is up for the position or not. I would rather protect the middle of the line with the best OG for us in the draft.



Howdy skate

So let me ask you this ...
Is there doubt in anyone's mind that Fischer or Lane Johnson is a way better prospect than J. Martin.

So having answered that, who would you rather have watching your teams #1 asset ?

And having answered that, are you really loosing any talent by moving J. Martin back to RT or are you gaining an great talent at LT & simply reallocating a "good developing talent" at RT ???

It just kills me that anyone would be OK to simply award the LT position to Martin simply because he deserves an opportunity.

What he deserves is an opportunity to compete once we surround him with elite talent.


I hope we do move up to grab a superb talent at LT that way we have 2 very good
OTs & may the best man win.

sug


SUG & WB,
Please do not get me wrong, I would love to be able to trade up and get one of the top OT's. But I think it would be an expensive climb to go up and get one while we can get the top OG in the draft for us and pick up some other OT's in the draft to push Martin. Now I have heard so much back and forth as to whether Johnson would fit for our system and someone recently said that he needs to increase his strength (somewhat like Martin last season) so if we are going to go up and get an OT then I want it to be Fischer. If not then I want to sit at 12 and take Cooper or trade down and get him in the early 20's.


Hey Buddy
Look, where you and I differ is the value you put on an OG vs a LT.
I'd gladly offer up 2 quality OGs per 1 STUD LT.
Sorry but OGs are a dime a dozen by comparison.

The level of size to athleticism isolated to wide open spaces doesnt just fall off trees.
And we are litterally 2 - 3 pks away from from solidifying potential Bookend OTs.

Note: we need to keep in mind just how common the screen pass is in the WC Off.
I cant remember the last time we had an athletic Oline (much less an Off syst) that was capable of executing that.

Watch Green Bay & just how well they execute the screen over the yrs.

sug
_________________
# 52
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Russ57


Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 692
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay Sug. So who do we get, and how do we do it? It is fine and dandy to say "go get a stud LT". It is another thing to have a feasible plan. I would like to hear your plan.

I don't see a "stud LT" in this draft. I see two guys with great potential and one guy that can step in immediately and be a good solid player.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SUG


Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 6825
Location: Alameda, Ca
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Russ57 wrote:
Okay Sug. So who do we get, and how do we do it? It is fine and dandy to say "go get a stud LT". It is another thing to have a feasible plan. I would like to hear your plan.

I don't see a "stud LT" in this draft. I see two guys with great potential and one guy that can step in immediately and be a good solid player.


I would offer up trade 2B & Devon Bess.
If that doesn't get a bite I'd counter with pk 2A & Devon Bess.

He's a proven commodity clean off the field & a likely bonus to someone trying to improve their Off day 1.

Personally I like Fischer but I trust Philbin on any selection.

sug
_________________
# 52


Last edited by SUG on Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ViolentMonk71


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 3766
Location: Don Shula's front porch
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SUG wrote:
Russ57 wrote:
Okay Sug. So who do we get, and how do we do it? It is fine and dandy to say "go get a stud LT". It is another thing to have a feasible plan. I would like to hear your plan.

I don't see a "stud LT" in this draft. I see two guys with great potential and one guy that can step in immediately and be a good solid player.


I would offer up trade 2B & Devon Bess.
If that doesn't get a bite I'd counter with pk 2A & Devon Bess.

He's a proven commodity clean off the field & a likely bonus to someone trying to improve their Off day 1.

sug


Who would want Bess and his contract? 2.6 million and they only get him for a year....

He's maybe worth a 6th....
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SUG


Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 6825
Location: Alameda, Ca
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ViolentMonk71 wrote:
SUG wrote:
Russ57 wrote:
Okay Sug. So who do we get, and how do we do it? It is fine and dandy to say "go get a stud LT". It is another thing to have a feasible plan. I would like to hear your plan.

I don't see a "stud LT" in this draft. I see two guys with great potential and one guy that can step in immediately and be a good solid player.


I would offer up trade 2B & Devon Bess.
If that doesn't get a bite I'd counter with pk 2A & Devon Bess.

He's a proven commodity clean off the field & a likely bonus to someone trying to improve their Off day 1.

sug


Who would want Bess and his contract? 2.6 million and they only get him for a year....

He's maybe worth a 6th....


C'mon man, be reasonable !
A 6th !?!? Rolling Eyes

sug
_________________
# 52
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ViolentMonk71


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 3766
Location: Don Shula's front porch
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SUG wrote:
ViolentMonk71 wrote:
SUG wrote:
Russ57 wrote:
Okay Sug. So who do we get, and how do we do it? It is fine and dandy to say "go get a stud LT". It is another thing to have a feasible plan. I would like to hear your plan.

I don't see a "stud LT" in this draft. I see two guys with great potential and one guy that can step in immediately and be a good solid player.


I would offer up trade 2B & Devon Bess.
If that doesn't get a bite I'd counter with pk 2A & Devon Bess.

He's a proven commodity clean off the field & a likely bonus to someone trying to improve their Off day 1.

sug


Who would want Bess and his contract? 2.6 million and they only get him for a year....

He's maybe worth a 6th....


C'mon man, be reasonable !
A 6th !?!? Rolling Eyes

sug


I am....what do you think he is really worth?
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
green4gulf


Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 2290
Location: TN, by way of Palm Beach FL
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SUG wrote:
ViolentMonk71 wrote:
SUG wrote:
Russ57 wrote:
Okay Sug. So who do we get, and how do we do it? It is fine and dandy to say "go get a stud LT". It is another thing to have a feasible plan. I would like to hear your plan.

I don't see a "stud LT" in this draft. I see two guys with great potential and one guy that can step in immediately and be a good solid player.


I would offer up trade 2B & Devon Bess.
If that doesn't get a bite I'd counter with pk 2A & Devon Bess.

He's a proven commodity clean off the field & a likely bonus to someone trying to improve their Off day 1.

sug


Who would want Bess and his contract? 2.6 million and they only get him for a year....

He's maybe worth a 6th....


C'mon man, be reasonable !
A 6th !?!? Rolling Eyes

sug


I have to agree. If Bess only has 1 year left on his contract at 2.6 mil, then we would be lucky to get anything for him. He's not a red zone threat and has no real big play ability or potential.

If he had multiple years left on his deal then we might get a high 5th or low 4th for him, but that's probably just wishful thinking.

Just because we like the guy, doesn't mean he has any value.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Russ57


Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 692
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seriously Sugs, is that the best you got? You think you are going to move from #12 to Eric or Luke for the 42nd plus Bess?

Maybe if you include next years first it could happen. If that is what it costs would you do it?

Accept it, we can't get what you would call a "stud LT" at any reasonable price. To make matters worse, none of the guys that you think are stud really are.

Now if you really want to get depressed consider that we should be picking later next year. If you want a stud LT you are going to have to pick a guy with potential this year and coach him up. I have made my pick known. If we can't trade up for our stud (Eric, Lane, Luke) which one do you draft? And no, you can't pick the guy I picked (Armstead)!

If we are going to have a meaningful dicussion here it has to be based on realitic expectations.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SUG


Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 6825
Location: Alameda, Ca
PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

green4gulf wrote:
SUG wrote:
ViolentMonk71 wrote:
SUG wrote:
Russ57 wrote:
Okay Sug. So who do we get, and how do we do it? It is fine and dandy to say "go get a stud LT". It is another thing to have a feasible plan. I would like to hear your plan.

I don't see a "stud LT" in this draft. I see two guys with great potential and one guy that can step in immediately and be a good solid player.


I would offer up trade 2B & Devon Bess.
If that doesn't get a bite I'd counter with pk 2A & Devon Bess.

He's a proven commodity clean off the field & a likely bonus to someone trying to improve their Off day 1.

sug


Who would want Bess and his contract? 2.6 million and they only get him for a year....

He's maybe worth a 6th....


C'mon man, be reasonable !
A 6th !?!? Rolling Eyes

sug


I have to agree. If Bess only has 1 year left on his contract at 2.6 mil, then we would be lucky to get anything for him. He's not a red zone threat and has no real big play ability or potential.

If he had multiple years left on his deal then we might get a high 5th or low 4th for him, but that's probably just wishful thinking.

Just because we like the guy, doesn't mean he has any value.


Oh really, a guy who outside of the WC Off could crack any starting line up.
A 1st down generating machine who catches everything he touches.
A smart player & good route runner.
A guy who likely had the bulk of his contract paid.
A guy who can contribute on all 3 downs.

I'd say he's worth a low 3rd rbd pk all day and has value to a struggling team drafting high.

If we werent a WC Off I wouldnt trade him, dudes been money for us as a slot WR.
Wasnt he ranked as the next best slot WR to Wes Welker a yr ago...?

You guys are short changing a valuable player based on Mia abismal suckass Off the past 4 yrs.

I think the offer I suggested is a reasonable one.
Heck replace the D. Bess deal with Misi & a 2nd rnd pk.

But what you absolutely cannot do is refuse to try.

sug
_________________
# 52
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Mercury22


Most Valuable Poster (1st Ballot)

Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 12825
Location: the 50 yard line
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The NFL draft value chart suggests that

the Dolphins 1st round pick (#12 pick) = 1200 points
the Dolphins 2nd(a) round pick (#42 pick) = 480 points
the Dolphins 2nd(b) round pick (#52 pick) = 380 points


The #4 overall pick is worth= 1800
The #5 overall pick is worth= 1700
The #6 overall pick is worth= 1600


Assuming either Joeckel or Fisher make it to #4 (which I'd guess one might) the trade offer of our 1st, our 2nd(a) and Bess might be enough to get a team interested. That would be 1680 points + Bess. I'm not suggesting we should do that, or we will do that, only that its not that absurd to think that we could.
_________________
"22 players are involved in every football play. To value precisely the activity of one of them, it is first necessary to account for the actions of the other 21"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ViolentMonk71


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 3766
Location: Don Shula's front porch
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mercury22 wrote:
The NFL draft value chart suggests that

the Dolphins 1st round pick (#12 pick) = 1200 points
the Dolphins 2nd(a) round pick (#42 pick) = 480 points
the Dolphins 2nd(b) round pick (#52 pick) = 380 points


The #4 overall pick is worth= 1800
The #5 overall pick is worth= 1700
The #6 overall pick is worth= 1600


Assuming either Joeckel or Fisher make it to #4 (which I'd guess one might) the trade offer of our 1st, our 2nd(a) and Bess might be enough to get a team interested. That would be 1680 points + Bess. I'm not suggesting we should do that, or we will do that, only that its not that absurd to think that we could.


Problem is Bess isn't worth 120 points....that would be equivalent to a late 3rd rounder which is far too much for Bess....plus he would significantly more expensive then that 3rd rounder and he has only one year on his contract. Is it out of the realm of possibilities, but it is highly unlikely.

I think it may also be good to look at Ireland's track record in the 1st....1st round trade ups 0 1st round trade downs 1. And they traded down when they had the 12th pick.

I think we need to give up on the notion of trading trading up to the 4th or 5th....I could see trading up to 9 which would only cost the team their 3b for Lane Johnson. It would be a much better value overall. I know some question Johnson strength but he threw up 225 28 times (Fisher 27 and Joeckel 27).

I still would prefer to wait until the second round to address the position, but if there is a run on tackles then they may be left with out a viable option.

Another Option....

Minnesota has the 23 and 25th pick....760 and 720 for a total of....1480

Miami has the 12th (1200) and 77 (205) and 146 (33) for a total of 1438

Could be a solid deal that could give the Dolphins 4 picks in the 1st 2 rounds allow them to take 2 1st round talents while also preparing for a run on tackles.

Why would Minnesota trade? They just lost Percy Harvin, granted they signed Jennings and he is a very good receiver, but he isn't explosive....I get the feeling Austin and Patterson will be gone by 20 so trading up to land a dynamic play maker is not Minnesota just got rid of is a strong possibility.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bpastermack


Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 13205
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ViolentMonk71 wrote:
Mercury22 wrote:
The NFL draft value chart suggests that

the Dolphins 1st round pick (#12 pick) = 1200 points
the Dolphins 2nd(a) round pick (#42 pick) = 480 points
the Dolphins 2nd(b) round pick (#52 pick) = 380 points


The #4 overall pick is worth= 1800
The #5 overall pick is worth= 1700
The #6 overall pick is worth= 1600


Assuming either Joeckel or Fisher make it to #4 (which I'd guess one might) the trade offer of our 1st, our 2nd(a) and Bess might be enough to get a team interested. That would be 1680 points + Bess. I'm not suggesting we should do that, or we will do that, only that its not that absurd to think that we could.


Problem is Bess isn't worth 120 points....that would be equivalent to a late 3rd rounder which is far too much for Bess....plus he would significantly more expensive then that 3rd rounder and he has only one year on his contract. Is it out of the realm of possibilities, but it is highly unlikely.

I think it may also be good to look at Ireland's track record in the 1st....1st round trade ups 0 1st round trade downs 1. And they traded down when they had the 12th pick.

I think we need to give up on the notion of trading trading up to the 4th or 5th....I could see trading up to 9 which would only cost the team their 3b for Lane Johnson. It would be a much better value overall. I know some question Johnson strength but he threw up 225 28 times (Fisher 27 and Joeckel 27).

I still would prefer to wait until the second round to address the position, but if there is a run on tackles then they may be left with out a viable option.

Another Option....

Minnesota has the 23 and 25th pick....760 and 720 for a total of....1480

Miami has the 12th (1200) and 77 (205) and 146 (33) for a total of 1438

Could be a solid deal that could give the Dolphins 4 picks in the 1st 2 rounds allow them to take 2 1st round talents while also preparing for a run on tackles.

Why would Minnesota trade? They just lost Percy Harvin, granted they signed Jennings and he is a very good receiver, but he isn't explosive....I get the feeling Austin and Patterson will be gone by 20 so trading up to land a dynamic play maker is not Minnesota just got rid of is a strong possibility.


Trades do not always go exactly by the chart. Let's say they are on the fence about losing 120 points in the trade, and considering doing it anyways, but just not sure. Bess is the guy who could sweeten the pot a little and make them save face with their fans by "losing points"
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ViolentMonk71


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 3766
Location: Don Shula's front porch
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bpastermack wrote:
ViolentMonk71 wrote:
Mercury22 wrote:
The NFL draft value chart suggests that

the Dolphins 1st round pick (#12 pick) = 1200 points
the Dolphins 2nd(a) round pick (#42 pick) = 480 points
the Dolphins 2nd(b) round pick (#52 pick) = 380 points


The #4 overall pick is worth= 1800
The #5 overall pick is worth= 1700
The #6 overall pick is worth= 1600


Assuming either Joeckel or Fisher make it to #4 (which I'd guess one might) the trade offer of our 1st, our 2nd(a) and Bess might be enough to get a team interested. That would be 1680 points + Bess. I'm not suggesting we should do that, or we will do that, only that its not that absurd to think that we could.


Problem is Bess isn't worth 120 points....that would be equivalent to a late 3rd rounder which is far too much for Bess....plus he would significantly more expensive then that 3rd rounder and he has only one year on his contract. Is it out of the realm of possibilities, but it is highly unlikely.

I think it may also be good to look at Ireland's track record in the 1st....1st round trade ups 0 1st round trade downs 1. And they traded down when they had the 12th pick.

I think we need to give up on the notion of trading trading up to the 4th or 5th....I could see trading up to 9 which would only cost the team their 3b for Lane Johnson. It would be a much better value overall. I know some question Johnson strength but he threw up 225 28 times (Fisher 27 and Joeckel 27).

I still would prefer to wait until the second round to address the position, but if there is a run on tackles then they may be left with out a viable option.

Another Option....

Minnesota has the 23 and 25th pick....760 and 720 for a total of....1480

Miami has the 12th (1200) and 77 (205) and 146 (33) for a total of 1438

Could be a solid deal that could give the Dolphins 4 picks in the 1st 2 rounds allow them to take 2 1st round talents while also preparing for a run on tackles.

Why would Minnesota trade? They just lost Percy Harvin, granted they signed Jennings and he is a very good receiver, but he isn't explosive....I get the feeling Austin and Patterson will be gone by 20 so trading up to land a dynamic play maker is not Minnesota just got rid of is a strong possibility.


Trades do not always go exactly by the chart. Let's say they are on the fence about losing 120 points in the trade, and considering doing it anyways, but just not sure. Bess is the guy who could sweeten the pot a little and make them save face with their fans by "losing points"


We are still valuing one (unproven) OT as much as 3 players....far too much.

Again the issue is with Bess's contract...almost 3 million and they only get him for 1 year....not a good trade value....
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Warpticon


Joined: 21 May 2010
Posts: 1614
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anquan Boldin got a 6th. Why do you expect to get a 3rd for Bess?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Miami Dolphins All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Page 4 of 7

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group