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Homeland (Showtime) ~ *Spoilers Inside*
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MrDrew


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This show stresses me out. So good.
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DRC29 INT


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Finally caught up. Was stuck on Episode 4 of S1 for a good month or so, but after reading about how good Episode 2 of S2 was, I went on a Homeland watching binge.

Episode 2 was insane. I wonder what happens to Brody now?
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Eksynyt


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 2:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great show...just keeps getting better. The writing is so tight.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Holy frijoles, was that intense. I just sat there and thought "Man, those spec-ops in the building are DEAD, someone ratted 'em out..." the whole time. Then when Carrie was rummaging through the apartment, I figured she'd be killed, or captured...and Estes would be quick to disavor knowledge of her and call her a rougue, leading Saul to go off the books to get her back.

That didn't happen...but who cares, this last episode was nearly flawless.
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THE DUKE


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
Holy frijoles, was that intense. I just sat there and thought "Man, those spec-ops in the building are DEAD, someone ratted 'em out..." the whole time. Then when Carrie was rummaging through the apartment, I figured she'd be killed, or captured...and Estes would be quick to disavor knowledge of her and call her a rougue, leading Saul to go off the books to get her back.

That didn't happen...but who cares, this last episode was nearly flawless.


I felt pretty confident they weren't going to kill one of the 2 main characters in the secknd episode of season 2.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

THE DUKE wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
Holy frijoles, was that intense. I just sat there and thought "Man, those spec-ops in the building are DEAD, someone ratted 'em out..." the whole time. Then when Carrie was rummaging through the apartment, I figured she'd be killed, or captured...and Estes would be quick to disavor knowledge of her and call her a rougue, leading Saul to go off the books to get her back.

That didn't happen...but who cares, this last episode was nearly flawless.


I felt pretty confident they weren't going to kill one of the 2 main characters in the secknd episode of season 2.


Agree, but it was still damn intense.
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BaltimoreTerp


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are things that are going to bug me every week about the show, like the constant incredible coincidences (brb honey, I'm going to drive to the Pentagon and get randomly invited into a top secret meeting where we're trying to assasinate the most wanted terrorist alive so that I can text him under the table and ruin the mission at the last second!) that would make Aaron Sorkin and Newsroom blush, or the fact that the vice president seemingly talks counterterrorism strategy like a gossiping 16 year old girl. But putting that aside, this show is still getting it done. Phenomenal tension and acting. Every scene leaves you at the edge of your seat.

The reveal at the end of the episode was surprising in how early in the season it happened. Since we all know this isn't going to end with Saul emailing Estes and being like, "Hey, look what I found!" and then Brody is exposed and Carrie is exonerated, you have to wonder how they drag it out. Personally, I fear for Saul's life at the moment. I was thinking that maybe the other guy with him in Beirut would turn out to be a mole, but that wouldn't make much sense considering Abu Nazir needed Brody's text message to save his life when a mole on the inside of the operation could have made him aware of it from the start. But we'll see. Nothing is ever as it seems with this show.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wanted to get to this earlier, but...just didn't have the time. Great post overall BTerp, allow me to chime in:

BaltimoreTerp wrote:
Really strong first episode. Loved 'the smile' at the end... nobody plays crazy like Clair Danes.

When watching the last two episodes, I don't feel as if the smile was "crazy" Carrie; Moreso, it was Carrie re-affirming what she believed, and that she was an amazing CIA operative and field agent. She had a brutal tail on her, prepared to kill her...and she utilized her surroundings to the best of her ability, actually disarmed her tail, used the crowd to create a scene, and walked away unscathed. She was smiling because despite the last few months of intense mental therapy, she still had that "knack" that made her one of the best field agents for the CIA...

...and this last episode is bringing in the "yang" to her initial ying, and that is those who are in charge of her CIA career questioning her - which takes her back to square one, where she is questioning herself. The scene on the rooftop spoke towards that, as she even admitted that "old Carrie" she trust, which is why they should move forward with the spec-op.

Quote:
One thing that bugged me was the idea that Abu Nazir and al Qaeda would be motivated to launch attacks in retaliation for Israeli bomb attacks on Iran. They made a big show in the Quaker meeting scene of saying, "Lumping all Arabs/Muslims is wrong," and then sort of make that same mistake, misunderstanding the complex, often adversarial relationship between the Sunni terrorist organization and the Shi'a, Persian ruling class of Tehran.

I think this is another string in the web of who Abu Nazir is, who they are trying to build him up as; In following the aftermath of the death of Osama bin Ladin (in real life) the one thing that people said about this "loss" at the top is the ability that bin Laden had in gathering "outsiders" to his cause. Osama bin Ladin's "strength" as the head of al Queida was to bring many people - most with no real dog in the fight in the Middle East - to his side. He had droves or Phillipine-originating Muslims prepared to take up his cause, he had droves of African-dwelling Muslims outside of Sudan/Morocco with him on his cause...people who didn't have the same interests, were all lining up to take on the cause with him. People posed this ability as his "charisma" towards the efforts. Sure, there were others who could plan and oversee execution of plans as well (if not better) than bin Laden, but amassing the foot soilders to fight this war? That was bin Laden's calling card in his time as the head of al Queida.

After seeing this joint effort shown on the show, I believe that they're trying to build up Abu Nazir as having the same effect - in fact, having a GREATER effect, able to get two differing factions to put down their differences and come together as a singular unit, to bring down a singular "foe" in their eyes. You can see the seeds of this from the onset of the show, and in the conversion of Brody. For all intensive purposes, Brody still loves the US, he is a 3rd generation Marine who still considers himself a Marine in service of the United States; Yet, it was the - for a lack of a better word, "charisma" - shown by Abu Nazir that got him to take his sights off of the Middle Eastern power players, and focus squarely on the US power players.

That's how I justify it, at least. But, very good point you bring up; I just can't seem to think that a show that tries to bring the other side of the equasion into plain sight would miss on such a critical detail as you presented.

Quote:
And the thing was, they didn't really even need Abu Nazir, or rather, his reporter mole ambassador to Brody, to invoke the Iran bombings to go in the direction of them planning another attack, and they otherwise got it right by having Carrie and Saul tracking the attack plans that Iran's client organization Hezbollah as a likely starting point for retaliatory attacks. It just seemed to me a rare moment of sloppiness for a show that otherwise does a pretty good job in injecting a dose of nuance (and more personally driven emotion) into the logic of geopolitical conflict.

I think the use of Abu Nazir (outside of what I outlined above) also served as that ever-present carrot to dangle in front of Carrie's face, something that gets her back on point and back in the fight (and advance the plot with their leading lady back in the fold). By everything we had saw in her interactions with David Estes in the 1st episode, it looked as if Carrie wanted nothing to do with the CIA. Initially, she wanted to pass on the chance to speak with her asset, but elected to do so anyways. (with the 2nd episode lending light on how there is a personal connection between the asset and Carrie; Mayhaps she felt a need to protect someone she had saved to begin with? I dunno). She saw herself in the field again, executing as she is used to (which got her to smile) but once she met with her contact and the name "Abu Nazir" came back up - well, her ears perked up, and her interest was renewed again. She explained her findings (despite being met with skepticism) and when she got the green light, she took it upon herself to gather additional information, even at the expense of her safety, and the safety of her team.

Using Abu Nazir is the driver to keep Carrie in with regards to the show; It builds the point up that Nazir is Carrie's Moby Dick.

That's how I see it, at least...but could be wrong. Please, feel free to let me know how all of you see it.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

THE DUKE wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
Holy frijoles, was that intense. I just sat there and thought "Man, those spec-ops in the building are DEAD, someone ratted 'em out..." the whole time. Then when Carrie was rummaging through the apartment, I figured she'd be killed, or captured...and Estes would be quick to disavor knowledge of her and call her a rougue, leading Saul to go off the books to get her back.

That didn't happen...but who cares, this last episode was nearly flawless.


I felt pretty confident they weren't going to kill one of the 2 main characters in the secknd episode of season 2.


Captured is still an option, no?
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
THE DUKE wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
Holy frijoles, was that intense. I just sat there and thought "Man, those spec-ops in the building are DEAD, someone ratted 'em out..." the whole time. Then when Carrie was rummaging through the apartment, I figured she'd be killed, or captured...and Estes would be quick to disavor knowledge of her and call her a rougue, leading Saul to go off the books to get her back.

That didn't happen...but who cares, this last episode was nearly flawless.


I felt pretty confident they weren't going to kill one of the 2 main characters in the secknd episode of season 2.


Captured is still an option, no?


I hope not. Especially them capturing Saul. Would just add on to the list of coincidences that have gone Brody's way. I hope Brody faces this and wonder how they'd go about the entire situation. Capturing Saul (and I know your original post was in regards to Carrie) would just be lame, but we'll see.
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MrDrew


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My wife was wondering how may people actually got the "May 1" reference?
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ThinkICare


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrDrew wrote:
My wife was wondering how may people actually got the "May 1" reference?


I didn't get it at the time. Just means May Day, right?
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MrDrew


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ThinkICare wrote:
MrDrew wrote:
My wife was wondering how may people actually got the "May 1" reference?


I didn't get it at the time. Just means May Day, right?


It was the day bin Laden was killed.

It was also the day I broke my ankle, which made it a pretty memorable day. Probably the only reason I caught it.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrDrew wrote:
ThinkICare wrote:
MrDrew wrote:
My wife was wondering how may people actually got the "May 1" reference?


I didn't get it at the time. Just means May Day, right?


It was the day bin Laden was killed.

It was also the day I broke my ankle, which made it a pretty memorable day. Probably the only reason I caught it.


Completely over my head at the time.
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ThinkICare


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrDrew wrote:


It was the day bin Laden was killed.

It was also the day I broke my ankle, which made it a pretty memorable day. Probably the only reason I caught it.


Oh, didn't realize. I thought maybe Brody was just signalling May Day, as in alerting the people he knows close to Nazir. Interesting.
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