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ryknowssd
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Posts: 22045
Location: Awesomeville
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 Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 3:30 pm Post subject: I love packages. |
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No, but for seriously and stuff. Here's what our lineup should look like in different packages this year:
3-4 base
LE: Tyson Jackson (4/5 technique)
NT: Dontari Poe (0/1 technique)
RE: Glenn Dorsey (4/5 technique)
LOLB: Justin Houston
LILB: Jovan Belcher
RILB: Derrick Johnson
ROLB: Tamba Hali
CB: Brandon Flowers, Stanford Routt
SS: Eric Berry
FS: Kendrick Lewis
Nickel Package
LE: Dontari Poe (3-5 tecnhique)
RE: Allen Bailey (3-5 technique)
LOLB: Justin Houston
ILB: Derrick Johnson
ROLB: Tamba Hali
Jack: DeQuan Menzie/Jovan Belcher
CB: Brandon Flowers, Stanford Routt
NCB: Javier Arenas
SS: Eric Berry
FS: Kendrick Lewis
Goal Line
LE: Justin Houston (7 technique)
DT: Tyson Jackson (5 technique)
NG: Amon Gordon/Jerrell Powe (3 technique)
NT: Dontari Poe (0/1 technique)
DT: Glenn Dorsey (3 technique)
RE: Allen Bailey (5 technique)
LOLB: Derrick Johnson
ROLB: Tamba Hali
CB: Brandon Flowers, Stanford Routt
Jack: Eric Berry
4-3 Base
LE: Tyson Jackson (5-7 technique)
DT: Dontari Poe (2-4 technique)
UT: Glenn Dorsey (3 technique)
RE: Allen Bailey (5-7 technique)
LOLB: Justin Houston
MLB: Derrick Johnson
ROLB: Tamba Hali
CB: Brandon Flowers, Stanford Routt
SS: Eric Berry
FS: Kendrick Lewis
The point of posting this thread? To point out that we gots lotsa beef. We also have a very, VERY versatile unit. The package possibilities are endless. I especially like our goal line package this year. Between Poe, Gordon, TJax, Dorsey and Powe, that's over 1600 pounds of big uglies that you're gonna have to run through. No, that's not a typo. Six. Teen. Hundred. Pounds.
I've had some time today to go back and watch a couple games from last season and evaluate performances and that's what got me thinking about this topic. Generally speaking, unless we rushed both Hali AND Houston, we didn't get much pressure out of our base 3-4 front. I also noticed that Dorsey was getting very good push and penetrating his gap well on passing plays, but he was often double teamed on the plays where he even had the opportunity to do so. With Poe, that won't happen. Poe's gonna DEMAND double teams, freeing up Dorsey to make many more plays this year. I'm personally predicting that Dorsey will have 4 sacks this year. Nothing earth shattering, but I don't see any way he doesn't show drastic improvement unless Powe just doesn't get to play until late in the season. Poe's presence alone will also free up Tamba and Houston to get after the QB. I see us as a top 12 team in pass rush this year. I know, bold prediction, right?
What are your thoughts on this?
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Mikek163
Joined: 24 Nov 2008
Posts: 4703
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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I agree with all of this. I think we will be playing some 3-2-6 as well this year. Versatility has always been the name of the game with Pioli and Co, and we finally have it completely figured out on defense.
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kylecumberland
Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 1002
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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Can the season Start now? I couldn't agree more about the versatility of our defense. We can match up with any type of offense. Anything from a Tim Tebow rushing/option offense, to a Green Bay/ New England spread/multiple reciever passing attacks.
The only thing I would change is having Tamba play RDE in the base 4-3, rather than ROLB. Not sure who I would put at ROLB in that situation. Maybe Sheffield? Gabe Miller? Studebaker? |
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ryknowssd
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Posts: 22045
Location: Awesomeville
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 4:05 pm Post subject: |
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| kylecumberland wrote: | | The only thing I would change is having Tamba play RDE in the base 4-3, rather than ROLB. Not sure who I would put at ROLB in that situation. Maybe Sheffield? Gabe Miller? Studebaker? |
I thought about that as well, but ultimately, it came down to who would replace him instead. If it's an obvious running down, just slide DJ outside and put Belcher in the middle, but if it's a potential passing down, we would need DJ in the middle to drop into coverage. That leaves Belcher, Studebaker, Sheffield, Miller or Bailey playing ROLB and none of them exactly strike fear into anyone. With Tamba at ROLB and Bailey at RE, it'd be the most balanced, versatile 4-3 unit we could field IMO.
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brawl.kc
Joined: 26 Apr 2008
Posts: 2042
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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| ryknowssd wrote: | | kylecumberland wrote: | | The only thing I would change is having Tamba play RDE in the base 4-3, rather than ROLB. Not sure who I would put at ROLB in that situation. Maybe Sheffield? Gabe Miller? Studebaker? |
I thought about that as well, but ultimately, it came down to who would replace him instead. If it's an obvious running down, just slide DJ outside and put Belcher in the middle, but if it's a potential passing down, we would need DJ in the middle to drop into coverage. That leaves Belcher, Studebaker, Sheffield, Miller or Bailey playing ROLB and none of them exactly strike fear into anyone. With Tamba at ROLB and Bailey at RE, it'd be the most balanced, versatile 4-3 unit we could field IMO. |
Tamba's worst year as a pro was as a 4-3 RDE. I know he's improved as a player since then and now quite frequently battles the LT to get to the QB, but I feel that he's better in a two-point stance when hitting that side as he gets to use his leverage more on a guy coming out of a three-point position.
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kylecumberland
Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 1002
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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| brawl.kc wrote: | | ryknowssd wrote: | | kylecumberland wrote: | | The only thing I would change is having Tamba play RDE in the base 4-3, rather than ROLB. Not sure who I would put at ROLB in that situation. Maybe Sheffield? Gabe Miller? Studebaker? |
I thought about that as well, but ultimately, it came down to who would replace him instead. If it's an obvious running down, just slide DJ outside and put Belcher in the middle, but if it's a potential passing down, we would need DJ in the middle to drop into coverage. That leaves Belcher, Studebaker, Sheffield, Miller or Bailey playing ROLB and none of them exactly strike fear into anyone. With Tamba at ROLB and Bailey at RE, it'd be the most balanced, versatile 4-3 unit we could field IMO. |
Tamba's worst year as a pro was as a 4-3 RDE. I know he's improved as a player since then and now quite frequently battles the LT to get to the QB, but I feel that he's better in a two-point stance when hitting that side as he gets to use his leverage more on a guy coming out of a three-point position. |
But he also had a very impressive rookie year playing RDE. He is a beast no matter where he plays. He is better now, because he was taught how to use his hands VERY well. He was trained by some kind of MMA guru or something. That combined with more experience is what made him go from good to elite IMO. the problem with him being an OLB in a 4-3 is that he will have to play in coverage a lot more. We don't want him in coverage, we want him getting after the passer every down. Romeo doesn't like to blitz much, If you send tamba as a blitzer that will be 5 guys rushing the QB, which means someone is HOT, and the QB just has to find who is open. Considering we don't blitz much, Tamba would be in coverage a lot. that seems counterproductive to me. |
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ryknowssd
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Posts: 22045
Location: Awesomeville
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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| kylecumberland wrote: | | But he also had a very impressive rookie year playing RDE. |
No he didn't. He played LE his rookie year, opposite Jared Allen. Once we traded Jared to Minny, we moved him to RE and that was the worst year he's had as a pro.
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kylecumberland
Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 1002
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 12:04 am Post subject: |
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| ryknowssd wrote: | | kylecumberland wrote: | | But he also had a very impressive rookie year playing RDE. |
No he didn't. He played LE his rookie year, opposite Jared Allen. Once we traded Jared to Minny, we moved him to RE and that was the worst year he's had as a pro. |
Ah yeah you are right. He still did play defensive end though, so I think the point is still valid whether left or right DE. |
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nicfre2011
Joined: 15 Mar 2011
Posts: 5303
Location: SC
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 8:46 am Post subject: |
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| You guys really think Poe will be our starting nose tackle out of the gate? Also I am surprised with how many people in here love Powe that he isn't mentioned in any fronts. |
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nicfre2011
Joined: 15 Mar 2011
Posts: 5303
Location: SC
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 8:49 am Post subject: |
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| Also, just another point - this really isn't the topic for it, but after looking at all of the sub-packages and alignments, is anyone else a little nervous about our pass rush if either Hali or Houston go down (or if Houston has a sophomore slump)? Where are we going to get any pass rush from? Sheffield? Studebaker? Miller? Sheffield and Miller are pretty much unknowns and while with Studebaker we know a little more about what he brings to the table - and that really isn't much as a pass rusher. |
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onejayhawk
Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 5054
Location: Waco, Tx
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 9:32 am Post subject: |
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| nicfre2011 wrote: | | You guys really think Poe will be our starting nose tackle out of the gate? Also I am surprised with how many people in here love Powe that he isn't mentioned in any fronts. |
No. That's Powe's job. Poe has next to zero experience head up on a man. Powe at least has last season in PS. As a pure road block, I would not expect less than adequate performance. Powe and Poe will get a lot of snaps between them.
Poe is in the nickel and short yardage sub packages. We should be seeing less draw action this year. I can see two options: Poe and Bailey; Poe and Dorsey. Either case the DT play the single gap and try to collapse the pocket. I expect Poe to take a run at the 4 sacks he got for Memphis in 2011.
J
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Rearviewmirror
Joined: 24 Jan 2009
Posts: 17483
Location: Koch Arena. Ryknowssd makes BAD sigs
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| nicfre2011 wrote: | | Also, just another point - this really isn't the topic for it, but after looking at all of the sub-packages and alignments, is anyone else a little nervous about our pass rush if either Hali or Houston go down (or if Houston has a sophomore slump)? Where are we going to get any pass rush from? Sheffield? Studebaker? Miller? Sheffield and Miller are pretty much unknowns and while with Studebaker we know a little more about what he brings to the table - and that really isn't much as a pass rusher. |
I think Sheffield can rush the passer. He was used a little last year before Houston got his legs wet. It won't be as good (obviously since Tamba is a top 5 pass rusher in the league) but I don't see it becoming horrendous. I think Houston solidifies himself as a beast pass rusher this year, and maybe Miller can be as well.
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kylecumberland
Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 1002
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| nicfre2011 wrote: | | Also, just another point - this really isn't the topic for it, but after looking at all of the sub-packages and alignments, is anyone else a little nervous about our pass rush if either Hali or Houston go down (or if Houston has a sophomore slump)? Where are we going to get any pass rush from? Sheffield? Studebaker? Miller? Sheffield and Miller are pretty much unknowns and while with Studebaker we know a little more about what he brings to the table - and that really isn't much as a pass rusher. |
I am worried, but so is every other nfl team I think. not many teams have great pass rushers as back ups. Guys like Tamba Hali, Demarcus ware, Jared allen, etc are not replaceable. I think Justin Houston will prove to be on that elite level this year also. Sheffield was a a dynamic pass rusher in college. I think that is the best you can hope for when losing an elite pass rusher. It's kind of like losing a franchise QB. You just have to hope his replacement isn't horrible, but you know there is going to be a drop off. |
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nicfre2011
Joined: 15 Mar 2011
Posts: 5303
Location: SC
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:45 am Post subject: |
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| Rearviewmirror wrote: | | nicfre2011 wrote: | | Also, just another point - this really isn't the topic for it, but after looking at all of the sub-packages and alignments, is anyone else a little nervous about our pass rush if either Hali or Houston go down (or if Houston has a sophomore slump)? Where are we going to get any pass rush from? Sheffield? Studebaker? Miller? Sheffield and Miller are pretty much unknowns and while with Studebaker we know a little more about what he brings to the table - and that really isn't much as a pass rusher. |
I think Sheffield can rush the passer. He was used a little last year before Houston got his legs wet. It won't be as good (obviously since Tamba is a top 5 pass rusher in the league) but I don't see it becoming horrendous. I think Houston solidifies himself as a beast pass rusher this year, and maybe Miller can be as well. |
I am not sure I have as much confidence in Sheffield. Miller is an unknown as I mentioned. But I don't know that can bank on him being anything more than a special teamer until he proves otherwise.
And I completely understand the point made by kyle about every team is looking for pass rushers - I just think our pass rush is as of right now is Hali with Houston's potential. IMO we don't have anyone else on our roster at the OLB position that I would say an opposing offense would even be remotely worried about. |
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Buckweath
Joined: 28 Sep 2009
Posts: 803
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| nicfre2011 wrote: | | Rearviewmirror wrote: | | nicfre2011 wrote: | | Also, just another point - this really isn't the topic for it, but after looking at all of the sub-packages and alignments, is anyone else a little nervous about our pass rush if either Hali or Houston go down (or if Houston has a sophomore slump)? Where are we going to get any pass rush from? Sheffield? Studebaker? Miller? Sheffield and Miller are pretty much unknowns and while with Studebaker we know a little more about what he brings to the table - and that really isn't much as a pass rusher. |
I think Sheffield can rush the passer. He was used a little last year before Houston got his legs wet. It won't be as good (obviously since Tamba is a top 5 pass rusher in the league) but I don't see it becoming horrendous. I think Houston solidifies himself as a beast pass rusher this year, and maybe Miller can be as well. |
I am not sure I have as much confidence in Sheffield. Miller is an unknown as I mentioned. But I don't know that can bank on him being anything more than a special teamer until he proves otherwise.
And I completely understand the point made by kyle about every team is looking for pass rushers - I just think our pass rush is as of right now is Hali with Houston's potential. IMO we don't have anyone else on our roster at the OLB position that I would say an opposing offense would even be remotely worried about. |
Sheffield and Studebaker make for decent depth at OLB. Of course a guy like Sheffield hasn't proved much so far, because he hasn't had the opportunity to play regularly and prove himself. Honestly, I don't think our depth at OLB is any worse than most teams.
You saw Justin Houston play last year and he was poor to average for the first half of the season but he became solid in the last games and he could prove to be a star this season. If he was a backup all of last season and didn't play much, you probably wouldn't have much confidence in him right? |
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