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ZoomWaffle
Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 4567
Location: AZ
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 Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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| JTagg7754 wrote: | | OakRaiders3828 wrote: | Those TE's listed play with elite quarterbacks on teams that rarely run the ball.
For every Graham, Clark, and Hernandez (Brees, Brady, Manning) there is Gronkowski, Davis, Miller, Gates, Gonzalez ( who can block)
And Finley? Finley sucks. Yeah he draws double coverage at times but he can't block and has stone hands. Definitely overrated
There's exceptions to every rule and in our offense, TE's need to block. Hopefully Ausberry can do both but if not that's why we keep Myers and maybe Gordon around. |
I'm not suggesting Pryor can be our 100% solution to TEs. Teams use blocking a receiving TEs all the time. I'm suggesting his athleticism could be utilized in that position more than holding a clipboard as the 3rd string QB when we need a TE. IMO, it's our weakest position and badly. |
I know some offenses can use TEs strictly as receivers, and thats fine. But honestly, I think Pryor would do more for the team as a 3rd string QB who has a few Wildcat or similar packages that he can get in on a few times a game or in goal line situations. Then again, it would be cool to see him line up at WR/TE once in a while just to confuse the D and/or create a mismatch. I just think he could offer more as a GL/Wildcat QB who maybe lines up at WR then a full-time, #2 or even 3 TE.
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| La_Vader wrote: | | I wouldn't trade Pryor for any prospect in this years draft. Quote me on that |
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raiders707
Joined: 25 Sep 2008
Posts: 510
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| Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Haven't been following too much besides what I see on twitter and csn bay area but it looks like we have young potential good wr with a lot of upside in our rookies udfa and our wr that are in 2nd and 3rd and 4th years!! TE is another thing to think about yeah hopefully ash burry will turn out good worth it to me for a 7th round pick right? I think we will be good if we hit all cylinders on both side of the ball offense and defense if we can be top 15 in D and handle bidnizz again in running we're Gunna be crowned afc west champs |
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Dreadymatt
Joined: 05 Feb 2010
Posts: 756
Location: Saturn
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| Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 5:01 pm Post subject: |
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| If you think we're short at TE what about Shockey? |
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Baggabonez
Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 3746
Location: RaiderNation
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| Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Dreadymatt wrote: | | If you think we're short at TE what about Shockey? |
IMO, the Raiders take their lumps at TE this season and shore up the position in 2013. Myers will be the official starter but I expect to see Reece & Criner line up there as well.
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2013 Mancrush: DT Richardson, OT Joeckel, FS Vaccaro, FS Rambo, WR Dobson, RB Michael, TE McDonald, OT Foketi, WR Swope |
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Dreadymatt
Joined: 05 Feb 2010
Posts: 756
Location: Saturn
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:54 am Post subject: |
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| Baggabonez wrote: | | Dreadymatt wrote: | | If you think we're short at TE what about Shockey? |
IMO, the Raiders take their lumps at TE this season and shore up the position in 2013. Myers will be the official starter but I expect to see Reece & Criner line up there as well. |
Criner, I really hadn't considered him
Last edited by Dreadymatt on Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:00 am; edited 1 time in total |
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JTagg7754
Joined: 09 Nov 2010
Posts: 7221
Location: Somewhere in Ohio
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 8:56 am Post subject: |
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| ZoomWaffle wrote: | | JTagg7754 wrote: | | OakRaiders3828 wrote: | Those TE's listed play with elite quarterbacks on teams that rarely run the ball.
For every Graham, Clark, and Hernandez (Brees, Brady, Manning) there is Gronkowski, Davis, Miller, Gates, Gonzalez ( who can block)
And Finley? Finley sucks. Yeah he draws double coverage at times but he can't block and has stone hands. Definitely overrated
There's exceptions to every rule and in our offense, TE's need to block. Hopefully Ausberry can do both but if not that's why we keep Myers and maybe Gordon around. |
I'm not suggesting Pryor can be our 100% solution to TEs. Teams use blocking a receiving TEs all the time. I'm suggesting his athleticism could be utilized in that position more than holding a clipboard as the 3rd string QB when we need a TE. IMO, it's our weakest position and badly. |
I know some offenses can use TEs strictly as receivers, and thats fine. But honestly, I think Pryor would do more for the team as a 3rd string QB who has a few Wildcat or similar packages that he can get in on a few times a game or in goal line situations. Then again, it would be cool to see him line up at WR/TE once in a while just to confuse the D and/or create a mismatch. I just think he could offer more as a GL/Wildcat QB who maybe lines up at WR then a full-time, #2 or even 3 TE. |
IMO, that's a good idea and he could do both. W/ him and McFadden out there, that's a lot of speed going in multiple directions. I wouldn't mind seeing that either but then again, I don't want the ball out of Carson's hand too often this season.
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| NCOUGHMAN wrote: | | Quote: |
you wouldnt want Rodgers Brady or Manning in his prime as your QBs? |
not with the way the nfl is right now. id take a guy like kaep over them |
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ZoomWaffle
Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 4567
Location: AZ
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| JTagg7754 wrote: | | ZoomWaffle wrote: | | JTagg7754 wrote: | | OakRaiders3828 wrote: | Those TE's listed play with elite quarterbacks on teams that rarely run the ball.
For every Graham, Clark, and Hernandez (Brees, Brady, Manning) there is Gronkowski, Davis, Miller, Gates, Gonzalez ( who can block)
And Finley? Finley sucks. Yeah he draws double coverage at times but he can't block and has stone hands. Definitely overrated
There's exceptions to every rule and in our offense, TE's need to block. Hopefully Ausberry can do both but if not that's why we keep Myers and maybe Gordon around. |
I'm not suggesting Pryor can be our 100% solution to TEs. Teams use blocking a receiving TEs all the time. I'm suggesting his athleticism could be utilized in that position more than holding a clipboard as the 3rd string QB when we need a TE. IMO, it's our weakest position and badly. |
I know some offenses can use TEs strictly as receivers, and thats fine. But honestly, I think Pryor would do more for the team as a 3rd string QB who has a few Wildcat or similar packages that he can get in on a few times a game or in goal line situations. Then again, it would be cool to see him line up at WR/TE once in a while just to confuse the D and/or create a mismatch. I just think he could offer more as a GL/Wildcat QB who maybe lines up at WR then a full-time, #2 or even 3 TE. |
IMO, that's a good idea and he could do both. W/ him and McFadden out there, that's a lot of speed going in multiple directions. I wouldn't mind seeing that either but then again, I don't want the ball out of Carson's hand too often this season. |
I agree with the bolded for sure. I wouldnt want Pryor taking snaps out of the Wildcat (or in any formation) every game. I think they should just use him sparingly, just to create the mismatches, or on the goal line where he can run it in or throw it.
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Silver&Black88 on the sig
| La_Vader wrote: | | I wouldn't trade Pryor for any prospect in this years draft. Quote me on that |
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JTagg7754
Joined: 09 Nov 2010
Posts: 7221
Location: Somewhere in Ohio
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| ZoomWaffle wrote: | | I agree with the bolded for sure. I wouldnt want Pryor taking snaps out of the Wildcat (or in any formation) every game. I think they should just use him sparingly, just to create the mismatches, or on the goal line where he can run it in or throw it. |
I can definitely agree w/ that. I want to live and die w/ Carson this season but using Pryor's athletic ability sparingly, wouldn't be anything I'm against at all. It most certainly would benefit us IMO as he is a completely different QB than Carson and we've seen the wildcat can have success when used at the right times.
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| NCOUGHMAN wrote: | | Quote: |
you wouldnt want Rodgers Brady or Manning in his prime as your QBs? |
not with the way the nfl is right now. id take a guy like kaep over them |
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oak42069
Joined: 08 Apr 2009
Posts: 2090
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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| JTagg7754 wrote: | | ZoomWaffle wrote: | | I agree with the bolded for sure. I wouldnt want Pryor taking snaps out of the Wildcat (or in any formation) every game. I think they should just use him sparingly, just to create the mismatches, or on the goal line where he can run it in or throw it. |
I can definitely agree w/ that. I want to live and die w/ Carson this season but using Pryor's athletic ability sparingly, wouldn't be anything I'm against at all. It most certainly would benefit us IMO as he is a completely different QB than Carson and we've seen the wildcat can have success when used at the right times. |
+1 fellas
am down for all of that |
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Baggabonez
Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 3746
Location: RaiderNation
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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| ZoomWaffle wrote: | | JTagg7754 wrote: | | OakRaiders3828 wrote: | Those TE's listed play with elite quarterbacks on teams that rarely run the ball.
For every Graham, Clark, and Hernandez (Brees, Brady, Manning) there is Gronkowski, Davis, Miller, Gates, Gonzalez ( who can block)
And Finley? Finley sucks. Yeah he draws double coverage at times but he can't block and has stone hands. Definitely overrated
There's exceptions to every rule and in our offense, TE's need to block. Hopefully Ausberry can do both but if not that's why we keep Myers and maybe Gordon around. |
I'm not suggesting Pryor can be our 100% solution to TEs. Teams use blocking a receiving TEs all the time. I'm suggesting his athleticism could be utilized in that position more than holding a clipboard as the 3rd string QB when we need a TE. IMO, it's our weakest position and badly. |
I know some offenses can use TEs strictly as receivers, and thats fine. But honestly, I think Pryor would do more for the team as a 3rd string QB who has a few Wildcat or similar packages that he can get in on a few times a game or in goal line situations. Then again, it would be cool to see him line up at WR/TE once in a while just to confuse the D and/or create a mismatch. I just think he could offer more as a GL/Wildcat QB who maybe lines up at WR then a full-time, #2 or even 3 TE. |
I was considering this. Imo, I just can't see Palmer surrendering reps to the wildcat. Palmer strikes me as Peytonesque, not in performance, but in regards to not wanting to ever surrender his reps. With Palmer having a burning desire to satisfy the stat whores I don't see him coming out in GL situations. No one will recount that Palmer came out in GL situations at the conclusion of the season and will use his lack of TDs as ammunition as to why he should be unseated. Palmer will become the face of the organization in 2012 for better or worse.
| NCOUGHMAN wrote: | | What you're saying doesn't matter. At the end of day, Palmer only threw 20 TDs. Period! Hardly fraanchise QB numbers. If Pryor can score 6 TDs in spot wildcat action, imo he has shown enough that his package should be expanded at least and at best he can handle being the starter. Let's resign Leinart as the CoP QB when Pryor splits out and trade Palmer for whatever the Raiders can get. (dream sequence over) |
Furthermore, Pryor has been frustrated by his lack of reps at QB. Wouldn't Pryor see reps at TE or WR as a precursor to a position switch? Especially if he finds success. Pryor wanted to quit football altogether last season.I don't think his heart would be in it. This only happens if Pryor is the catalyst and I don't foresee that happening.
_________________
2013 Mancrush: DT Richardson, OT Joeckel, FS Vaccaro, FS Rambo, WR Dobson, RB Michael, TE McDonald, OT Foketi, WR Swope |
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ZoomWaffle
Joined: 25 Apr 2010
Posts: 4567
Location: AZ
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| Baggabonez wrote: | | ZoomWaffle wrote: | | JTagg7754 wrote: | | OakRaiders3828 wrote: | Those TE's listed play with elite quarterbacks on teams that rarely run the ball.
For every Graham, Clark, and Hernandez (Brees, Brady, Manning) there is Gronkowski, Davis, Miller, Gates, Gonzalez ( who can block)
And Finley? Finley sucks. Yeah he draws double coverage at times but he can't block and has stone hands. Definitely overrated
There's exceptions to every rule and in our offense, TE's need to block. Hopefully Ausberry can do both but if not that's why we keep Myers and maybe Gordon around. |
I'm not suggesting Pryor can be our 100% solution to TEs. Teams use blocking a receiving TEs all the time. I'm suggesting his athleticism could be utilized in that position more than holding a clipboard as the 3rd string QB when we need a TE. IMO, it's our weakest position and badly. |
I know some offenses can use TEs strictly as receivers, and thats fine. But honestly, I think Pryor would do more for the team as a 3rd string QB who has a few Wildcat or similar packages that he can get in on a few times a game or in goal line situations. Then again, it would be cool to see him line up at WR/TE once in a while just to confuse the D and/or create a mismatch. I just think he could offer more as a GL/Wildcat QB who maybe lines up at WR then a full-time, #2 or even 3 TE. |
I was considering this. Imo, I just can't see Palmer surrendering reps to the wildcat. Palmer strikes me as Peytonesque, not in performance, but in regards to not wanting to ever surrender his reps. With Palmer having a burning desire to satisfy the stat whores I don't see him coming out in GL situations. No one will recount that Palmer came out in GL situations at the conclusion of the season and will use his lack of TDs as ammunition as to why he should be unseated. Palmer will become the face of the organization in 2012 for better or worse. |
I see what you are saying, but 1) It will be Allen, not Palmer who decides when (and if) Palmer surrenders snaps to Pryor. 2) I'm not talking about doing this in the middle of a drive, 4, 5, 6 times a game. I'm talking more like what Denver did with Tebow his rookie year: ocassionally, when we get inside the 5 yard line or so, put Pryor in at QB- whether that means Wildcat with Palmer lining up elsewhere, or Palmer coming out while Pryor takes the snap, and let the D worry about him running, handing off, or throwing. I dont mean every time we get near the GL, I just mean maybe once a game, if that- depending on how effective it is.
_________________
Silver&Black88 on the sig
| La_Vader wrote: | | I wouldn't trade Pryor for any prospect in this years draft. Quote me on that |
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oakdb36
Joined: 02 Mar 2006
Posts: 12723
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:45 am Post subject: |
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| Baggabonez wrote: | No one will recount that Palmer came out in GL situations at the conclusion of the season and will use his lack of TDs as ammunition as to why he should be unseated.
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I surely hope our front office and coaching staff would remember that fact and they're the decision makers.
It would only give ammo to the discussions in the media and among fans. |
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Baggabonez
Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 3746
Location: RaiderNation
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| ZoomWaffle wrote: |
I see what you are saying, but 1) It will be Allen, not Palmer who decides when (and if) Palmer surrenders snaps to Pryor. 2) I'm not talking about doing this in the middle of a drive, 4, 5, 6 times a game. I'm talking more like what Denver did with Tebow his rookie year: ocassionally, when we get inside the 5 yard line or so, put Pryor in at QB- whether that means Wildcat with Palmer lining up elsewhere, or Palmer coming out while Pryor takes the snap, and let the D worry about him running, handing off, or throwing. I dont mean every time we get near the GL, I just mean maybe once a game, if that- depending on how effective it is. |
Although polarizing, Palmer is still considered to be a franchise QB. What HC in his right mind would pull a franchise QB in the redzone? Show me an example where a franchise QB was pulled for a gimmick play? The NFL is a QB league now. If you have a real QB you don't pull him. The Raiders are absolutely totally committed to Palmer this season.
Furthermore, even with the extra practice time new HCs get not ONE inkling of wildcat. Pryor ends camps citing his lack of reps (totally justified imo). None of the wildcat is going to happen. Not one team (iirc) that has a franchise QB is deploying a CoP QB, Situational QB, Redzone QB or Wildcat. While some may not think so, the Raiders are under the impression they have a franchise QB.
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2013 Mancrush: DT Richardson, OT Joeckel, FS Vaccaro, FS Rambo, WR Dobson, RB Michael, TE McDonald, OT Foketi, WR Swope |
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bitty
Joined: 19 Jan 2005
Posts: 2985
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:59 am Post subject: |
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| In the red zone put the ball in D-MACs hands and watch him find the end zone. |
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NCOUGHMAN
Joined: 25 Mar 2008
Posts: 12572
Location: Stockton via East Palo Alto
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Baggabonez wrote: | | ZoomWaffle wrote: | | JTagg7754 wrote: | | OakRaiders3828 wrote: | Those TE's listed play with elite quarterbacks on teams that rarely run the ball.
For every Graham, Clark, and Hernandez (Brees, Brady, Manning) there is Gronkowski, Davis, Miller, Gates, Gonzalez ( who can block)
And Finley? Finley sucks. Yeah he draws double coverage at times but he can't block and has stone hands. Definitely overrated
There's exceptions to every rule and in our offense, TE's need to block. Hopefully Ausberry can do both but if not that's why we keep Myers and maybe Gordon around. |
I'm not suggesting Pryor can be our 100% solution to TEs. Teams use blocking a receiving TEs all the time. I'm suggesting his athleticism could be utilized in that position more than holding a clipboard as the 3rd string QB when we need a TE. IMO, it's our weakest position and badly. |
I know some offenses can use TEs strictly as receivers, and thats fine. But honestly, I think Pryor would do more for the team as a 3rd string QB who has a few Wildcat or similar packages that he can get in on a few times a game or in goal line situations. Then again, it would be cool to see him line up at WR/TE once in a while just to confuse the D and/or create a mismatch. I just think he could offer more as a GL/Wildcat QB who maybe lines up at WR then a full-time, #2 or even 3 TE. |
I was considering this. Imo, I just can't see Palmer surrendering reps to the wildcat. Palmer strikes me as Peytonesque, not in performance, but in regards to not wanting to ever surrender his reps. With Palmer having a burning desire to satisfy the stat whores I don't see him coming out in GL situations. No one will recount that Palmer came out in GL situations at the conclusion of the season and will use his lack of TDs as ammunition as to why he should be unseated. Palmer will become the face of the organization in 2012 for better or worse.
| NCOUGHMAN wrote: | | What you're saying doesn't matter. At the end of day, Palmer only threw 20 TDs. Period! Hardly fraanchise QB numbers. If Pryor can score 6 TDs in spot wildcat action, imo he has shown enough that his package should be expanded at least and at best he can handle being the starter. Let's resign Leinart as the CoP QB when Pryor splits out and trade Palmer for whatever the Raiders can get. (dream sequence over) |
Furthermore, Pryor has been frustrated by his lack of reps at QB. Wouldn't Pryor see reps at TE or WR as a precursor to a position switch? Especially if he finds success. Pryor wanted to quit football altogether last season.I don't think his heart would be in it. This only happens if Pryor is the catalyst and I don't foresee that happening. |
i never wrote that 
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| green24 wrote: | | NCOUGHMAN >>>>>> all of you |
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