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stu29er
Joined: 23 Oct 2010
Posts: 83
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 Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:10 am Post subject: |
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| Pack4life7 wrote: | | James jones is a good WR on a fair contract. I have no idea why people are wanting to get rid of him so bad. Aaron likes him and he's a huge insurance policy if Greg or Jordy tear their ACL week 1. |
You can't say stuff like this! |
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Scuba St3ve
Joined: 19 Mar 2012
Posts: 177
Location: Ashwaubenon
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:39 am Post subject: |
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| Sandybaby716 wrote: | | Scuba St3ve wrote: | | spilltray wrote: | | Scuba St3ve wrote: | did someone really say a second round pick for jones? what delusional [inappropriate/removed] planet are you from?
anyway... trading jones would be dumb as all hell. we are going to trade away our 3 so that our 6 gets a chance? |
3?
Personally here is how I stack up the passing options
Jennings
Nelson
Finley
Driver
Cobb
Jones
Jones isn't likely to get any better at this point. He is what he is, and that is a decently talented WR with a tendency to make the BIG mistake. He isn't especially dangerous and while he can get decent enough stats and probably could be a decent #2 for alot of teams, in terms of the Packers WR corps he really has no "special" in him. |
smh you cant be serious, im not even going to argue with this nonsense |
Is it because he had an extremely accurate and flawless description of Jones and his role in the offense in comparison to the other receivers?
Jones is just a guy. He is not a guy that I would want to trade, but he is just a guy. Whereas Jennings has extreme focus and wherewithal to always be in position to make a big play, Nelson has incredible physical gifts, Driver the experience and precision of his routes, and Cobb the immense agility, of all our receivers, Jones is the most ordinary. |
what did i say? i said jones is our 3, referring to our wide receivers.
obviously hes behind jennings and nelson but dude said he was 6th? youve gotta be pullin my leg on that one
jordy was thrown to 96 times and caught 68 passes: 70% catch rate
jennings was thrown to 101 times and caught 67 passes: 66%
finley targeted 93 times and caught 55: 59%
jones targeted 55(4th most 3rd most among WR) times caught 38(4th most 3rd among WR): 69% (3rd)
driver 56 times caught 37: 66%
cobb 31 times caught 25: 80% (bit of an outlier)
jordy dropped 3 balls, dropping 3% of passes thrown his way
jennings dropped 5, dropping 5%
finley dropped 14 dropping 15%
jones dropped 6 dropping 11%
driver dropped 8 dropping 14%
cobb dropped 4 dropping 13%
(our drop percentages are absolutely pathetic)
jones is 4th(3rd as far as WR) in total yards, but 2nd in yards per catch
jones is 4th (3rd as far as WR) in TDs but is second in TD's per catch
jones is 3rd in yards after catch but 2nd in YAC per total yards
jones is 4th(3rd as far as WR) in 20+ yard plays but is 1st in 20+ yard plays per total catches
when dude is constantly showing up at 2nd, 3rd, and 4th best on the team and isnt last or second to last even in any category, how is he our 6th option or 6th best receiving threat? james jones is our 3. Period. |
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spilltray
Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 8647
Location: Green Bay, WI
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:00 am Post subject: |
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| Scuba St3ve wrote: |
jordy was thrown to 96 times and caught 68 passes: 70% catch rate
jennings was thrown to 101 times and caught 67 passes: 66%
finley targeted 93 times and caught 55: 59%
jones targeted 55(4th most 3rd most among WR) times caught 38(4th most 3rd among WR): 69% (3rd)
driver 56 times caught 37: 66%
cobb 31 times caught 25: 80% (bit of an outlier)
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Driver was pretty beat up for a good chunk of last season. I expect him to be in the best shape he's been in years.
And the proof is in the pudding of your own stat right here
Jennings 101 targets
Nelson 96 targets
Finely 93 targets
Driver 56 targets
Jones 55 targets
Cobb 31 targets
I expect Cobb to move up the board this year with the season and an actual offseason under his belt to get comfortable. I expect Driver to be more effective than last season and I don't see any reason to expect Jones numbers to go up instead of down.
Listen if they were as high on him as you seem to be, then they wouldn't have let him shop himself everywhere and signed him to a bargain basement contract. There are also rumors of the Packers shopping him pre draft and currently and where there is smoke, there is often fire.
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Sandybaby716
Joined: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 3526
Location: Rhode Island
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:03 am Post subject: |
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actually, Driver was 3rd among WRs and 4th all-together in targets. Your own stats state that. And I expect Cobb to get more targets than Jones this season, which is not an unreasonable claim.
Discounting the TE position when claiming someones slot in the pecking order is misleading and inaccurate.
Fact is, Jones, aside from arguably Driver, is the most expendable player in our passing tree. Suggesting he's the third most essential is ludicrous.
That said, as always, he's still worth more to us than what we would likely net for him.
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| wgbeethree wrote: | | In all fairness it is kind of rude to just lay injured at their feet while the Lions defensive players are trying to hold a completely unrelated dance party. |
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AlexGreen#20
Joined: 13 Jun 2012
Posts: 878
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| spilltray wrote: | | Scuba St3ve wrote: |
jordy was thrown to 96 times and caught 68 passes: 70% catch rate
jennings was thrown to 101 times and caught 67 passes: 66%
finley targeted 93 times and caught 55: 59%
jones targeted 55(4th most 3rd most among WR) times caught 38(4th most 3rd among WR): 69% (3rd)
driver 56 times caught 37: 66%
cobb 31 times caught 25: 80% (bit of an outlier)
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Driver was pretty beat up for a good chunk of last season. I expect him to be in the best shape he's been in years.
And the proof is in the pudding of your own stat right here
Jennings 101 targets
Nelson 96 targets
Finely 93 targets
Driver 56 targets
Jones 55 targets
Cobb 31 targets
I expect Cobb to move up the board this year with the season and an actual offseason under his belt to get comfortable. I expect Driver to be more effective than last season and I don't see any reason to expect Jones numbers to go up instead of down.
Listen if they were as high on him as you seem to be, then they wouldn't have let him shop himself everywhere and signed him to a bargain basement contract. There are also rumors of the Packers shopping him pre draft and currently and where there is smoke, there is often fire. |
Rarely, if ever, do players as old as Driver have much better seasons. It's much more likely that Driver has another season of being nicked up and struggling than there is a chance of him getting back up to 75 targets.
It's also important to note that Driver was the starting A receiver last year. He's no longer got it in him to play the X or Y. I think everyone would greatly prefer that Cobb takes over the A role. Have Jones backup the X and Z spots, and have Driver back up all 3 but with particular emphasis on the A would be the ideal role for each guy, assuming that we're stuck with the current 5.
On a lot of the run or 50/50 downs in the Giants game, Driver was covered by a Safety. We need our A to win that matchup every snap, and Driver didn't. He just doesn't have the long speed to threaten deep. So much of our offense revolves around the comeback/back shoulder throws, and the WR needs to threaten the DB deep so that he turns his hips. Driver just can't do that against the better Safety's anymore, and that's a problem.
I'm not saying that Cobb is going to slide in perfectly right away as the A guy. He needs to show he can get off the jam, he needs to work on sinking his hips out of his cuts to get maximum separation, and he needs to have a full working concept of opposing zones. But, Cobb is going to get there eventually. He's got all the tools to be the next great A, and I have full faith in McCarthy and his staff to get his game smoothed out.
I think after this camp, Cobb will have the edge as the A, and Driver will be relegated to a 5th receiver role. The thing about that is that in our offense, we don't just use our 3 best guys in all our 3 receiver sets. We rotate in guys to keep them fresh, so Driver will get snaps.
Just my take on the situation. |
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Pack4life7
Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 2865
Location: Illinois
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| stu29er wrote: | | Pack4life7 wrote: | | James jones is a good WR on a fair contract. I have no idea why people are wanting to get rid of him so bad. Aaron likes him and he's a huge insurance policy if Greg or Jordy tear their ACL week 1. |
You can't say stuff like this! |
I agree it's blasphemous to even think it but as a team we were pretty lucky when it came to injuries last season if you think about it. Yes Collins went down and Clifton missed a lot of time but most seasons I would take that.
Our WR group as a whole looks a lot worse if Jones is gone and one of our main guys goes down.
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Scuba St3ve
Joined: 19 Mar 2012
Posts: 177
Location: Ashwaubenon
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Sandybaby716 wrote: | actually, Driver was 3rd among WRs and 4th all-together in targets. Your own stats state that. And I expect Cobb to get more targets than Jones this season, which is not an unreasonable claim.
Discounting the TE position when claiming someones slot in the pecking order is misleading and inaccurate.
Fact is, Jones, aside from arguably Driver, is the most expendable player in our passing tree. Suggesting he's the third most essential is ludicrous.
That said, as always, he's still worth more to us than what we would likely net for him. |
show me again where i said he is third most essential?
i said he is our thirdstring wide receiver
driver gets one more target then jones therefor driver must be our three and jones is our 4 right? 
starks is then higher receiving threat than cobb is then right
:dead:
Last edited by Scuba St3ve on Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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JustisM
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Posts: 16605
Location: Hood River, Oregon
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Pack4life7 wrote: | | Aaron likes him and he's a huge insurance policy if Greg or Jordy tear their ACL week 1. |
.........you don't say that...
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Pack4life7
Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 2865
Location: Illinois
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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| JustisM wrote: | | Pack4life7 wrote: | | Aaron likes him and he's a huge insurance policy if Greg or Jordy tear their ACL week 1. |
.........you don't say that... |
| stu29er wrote: | | Pack4life7 wrote: | | James jones is a good WR on a fair contract. I have no idea why people are wanting to get rid of him so bad. Aaron likes him and he's a huge insurance policy if Greg or Jordy tear their ACL week 1. |
You can't say stuff like this! |
I agree it's blasphemous to even think it but as a team we were pretty lucky when it came to injuries last season if you think about it. Yes Collins went down and Clifton missed a lot of time but most seasons I would take that.
Our WR group as a whole looks a lot worse if Jones is gone and one of our main guys goes down.
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Sandybaby716
Joined: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 3526
Location: Rhode Island
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Scuba St3ve wrote: | | Sandybaby716 wrote: | actually, Driver was 3rd among WRs and 4th all-together in targets. Your own stats state that. And I expect Cobb to get more targets than Jones this season, which is not an unreasonable claim.
Discounting the TE position when claiming someones slot in the pecking order is misleading and inaccurate.
Fact is, Jones, aside from arguably Driver, is the most expendable player in our passing tree. Suggesting he's the third most essential is ludicrous.
That said, as always, he's still worth more to us than what we would likely net for him. |
show me again where i said he is third most essential?
i said he is our third best wide receiver
driver gets one more target then jones therefor driver must be our three and jones is our 4 right?
starks is then higher receiving threat than cobb is then right
:dead: |
1. | Scuba St3ve wrote: | did someone really say a second round pick for jones? what delusional [inappropriate/removed] planet are you from?
anyway... trading jones would be dumb as all hell. we are going to trade away our 3 so that our 6 gets a chance? |
You said it right here. Calling him our "3" doesn't imply where he ranks in terms of ability, it's an implication that he is third in the pecking order. Also, discounting the TE position is, as I said before, misleading and withholding of important facts for your argument, which is a fallacy.
2. Starks had more targets than Cobb last season. He was, therefore, more involved with the passing offense than Cobb. I expect Cobb to pass several players in the pecking order, moving up to the 4 behind Jennings, Nelson, and Finley. Maybe Jones is our five. He's competing with Donald for that, but they were very even last season and it could go either way, especially with Driver being limited from injury in the middle of the season. Therefore, it isn't unreasonable to suggest that Jones will be the 6th option in the offense.
3. Don't make everything so personal. Focus on quality, sound arguments instead of put-downs or sarcastic remarks.
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| wgbeethree wrote: | | In all fairness it is kind of rude to just lay injured at their feet while the Lions defensive players are trying to hold a completely unrelated dance party. |
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Scuba St3ve
Joined: 19 Mar 2012
Posts: 177
Location: Ashwaubenon
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Sandybaby716 wrote: | | Scuba St3ve wrote: | | Sandybaby716 wrote: | actually, Driver was 3rd among WRs and 4th all-together in targets. Your own stats state that. And I expect Cobb to get more targets than Jones this season, which is not an unreasonable claim.
Discounting the TE position when claiming someones slot in the pecking order is misleading and inaccurate.
Fact is, Jones, aside from arguably Driver, is the most expendable player in our passing tree. Suggesting he's the third most essential is ludicrous.
That said, as always, he's still worth more to us than what we would likely net for him. |
show me again where i said he is third most essential?
i said he is our third best wide receiver
driver gets one more target then jones therefor driver must be our three and jones is our 4 right?
starks is then higher receiving threat than cobb is then right
:dead: |
1. | Scuba St3ve wrote: | did someone really say a second round pick for jones? what delusional [inappropriate/removed] planet are you from?
anyway... trading jones would be dumb as all hell. we are going to trade away our 3 so that our 6 gets a chance? |
You said it right here. Calling him our "3" doesn't imply where he ranks in terms of ability, it's an implication that he is third in the pecking order. Also, discounting the TE position is, as I said before, misleading and withholding of important facts for your argument, which is a fallacy.
2. Starks had more targets than Cobb last season. He was, therefore, more involved with the passing offense than Cobb. I expect Cobb to pass several players in the pecking order, moving up to the 4 behind Jennings, Nelson, and Finley. Maybe Jones is our five. He's competing with Donald for that, but they were very even last season and it could go either way, especially with Driver being limited from injury in the middle of the season. Therefore, it isn't unreasonable to suggest that Jones will be the 6th option in the offense.
3. Don't make everything so personal. Focus on quality, sound arguments instead of put-downs or sarcastic remarks. |
 haha ok man
edit: where the hell did i misslead? where the hell did i withold important facts, please do tell |
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gregoreo22
Joined: 20 Dec 2005
Posts: 2459
Location: GB
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palmy50
Joined: 26 Nov 2006
Posts: 12503
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:57 pm Post subject: Re: article on NFL.com |
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I'm not sure he is talking about the Packers players/brass there. Man gets paid good money for his gig. Good chance he would have put up better numbers and pulled more bank on most clubs. But the fact is the Packers respected him enough to pay him. If he feels this brass shows him a lack of respect.......shame on him!
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Sandybaby716
Joined: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 3526
Location: Rhode Island
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:06 am Post subject: |
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| Scuba St3ve wrote: | | edit: where the hell did i misslead? where the hell did i withold important facts, please do tell |
I already said where. If you don't see what you're looking for, re-read the post and you'll find it.
Being that you're calling your own literacy into question, I'll try to help. Calling Jones our three implies that he is higher on the receiving order than one Finley, Jennings, or Nelson.
Not only is this untrue, but it is misleading.
Suggesting that Finley doesn't count because he is a TE is the withholding of important facts for your argument. It makes your argument look more sound by using slective information, which, again, is a fallacy.
I could easily say that Cobb is the number two receiver on the team. And then say later I only meant among receivers under six foot.
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| wgbeethree wrote: | | In all fairness it is kind of rude to just lay injured at their feet while the Lions defensive players are trying to hold a completely unrelated dance party. |
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Scuba St3ve
Joined: 19 Mar 2012
Posts: 177
Location: Ashwaubenon
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:29 am Post subject: |
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| Sandybaby716 wrote: | | Scuba St3ve wrote: | | edit: where the hell did i misslead? where the hell did i withold important facts, please do tell |
I already said where. If you don't see what you're looking for, re-read the post and you'll find it.
Being that you're calling your own literacy into question, I'll try to help. Calling Jones our three implies that he is higher on the receiving order than one Finley, Jennings, or Nelson.
Not only is this untrue, but it is misleading.
Suggesting that Finley doesn't count because he is a TE is the withholding of important facts for your argument. It makes your argument look more sound by using slective information, which, again, is a fallacy.
I could easily say that Cobb is the number two receiver on the team. And then say later I only meant among receivers under six foot. |
thanks for the laugh
if i had said the same thing last year at this time about sam shields being our 3 (refering to our cornerback)s would you have seriously gone off on this hogwash [inappropriate/removed] tangent about how nick collins is better/more important to the team then sam shields?
you were proven wrong and you looked like an idiot so now you are retaliating and getting all defensive calling me illiterate. and i am just sitting here laughing at your dumbassness |
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