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vike daddy
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 66628
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 Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:22 am Post subject: our other tight end: John Carlson |
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a good interview with Carlson:
http://www.twincities.com/vikings/ci_20929827/bob-sansevere-vikings-tight-end-john-carlson-talks
Carlson: "Jim Kleinsasser probably was the best blocking tight end to ever play the game. I'm not going to be that. My goal always has been to be a well-rounded tight end. A guy who can contribute in the run game; a guy who can pass protect when asked to; a guy who can make plays in the passing game. I'm excited to play with Kyle Rudolph because he's the same kind of guy. I think together we can make a good combo."
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 39507
Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 10:37 am Post subject: |
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| Carlson is a nice compliment to Rudolph. I dont think Carlson is quite the receiver that Rudolph has shown to be, but I think Carlson should be a better blocker and overall, he is a much more balanced upgrade to Jimmy K as the #2 TE. |
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SteelKing728
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 10870
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 10:42 am Post subject: |
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I could see Carlson being a good redzone target for us.
I'm really glad he's a Viking. I've been rooting for him ever since he was a Seahawk.
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vike daddy
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:10 am Post subject: |
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you can tell from the interview that he's a very intelligent and articulate young man, for what that's worth. reminds me of Matt Birk.
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swiss_vike
Joined: 29 Jul 2011
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:59 am Post subject: |
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| both TE's are a huge downgrade when it comes to blocking and the run game compared to kleini and shiancoe. Carlson really needs to get into that role...because for catching, we have Rudy. |
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Klomp
Joined: 11 Aug 2011
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Location: The Home of Schwan's Ice Cream
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:18 pm Post subject: |
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| swiss_vike wrote: | | both TE's are a huge downgrade when it comes to blocking and the run game compared to kleini and shiancoe. Carlson really needs to get into that role...because for catching, we have Rudy. |
Wasn't Shanktoe a poor blocker? Obviously Saucer to anyone is a downgrade in blocking, but Carlson is much better in the passing game.
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
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Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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| swiss_vike wrote: | | both TE's are a huge downgrade when it comes to blocking and the run game compared to kleini and shiancoe. Carlson really needs to get into that role...because for catching, we have Rudy. |
Shiancoe was a very poor blocker.
While Rudolph and Carlson arent on the level of Kleinsasser, MN did upgrade the LT spot, so having blocking TEs may not be as much of a need as was last year.
However, Ellison is a damn fine blocker, both as a FB and TE, he will be the Jim Kleinsasser in the offense. The problem last year, Kleinsasser was the #2 TE for most of the year, hopefully with improved Oline play, the receiving TEs can see the field more than the blocking one. Carlson isnt a bad blocker, and is better than Shiancoe. I wouldnt call Rudolph a bad blocker, more of a raw blocker. His size and length alone will help him a lot with edge rushers. |
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vike daddy
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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| vikingsrule wrote: | | Ellison is a damn fine blocker, both as a FB and TE, he will be the Jim Kleinsasser in the offense. The problem last year, Kleinsasser was the #2 TE for most of the year, hopefully with improved Oline play, the receiving TEs can see the field more than the blocking one. |
that's pretty astute.
and might help to explain Spielman's "jump" to draft Ellison - it was so his previous acquisition of the team's TE's of the future can be more productive.
ie: score more points, instead of throw more blocks.
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Kellerman
Joined: 16 May 2010
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Location: Amsterdam
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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I, for one, am happy with our new #2 tight end. It seems to me that the thing that makes the TE position special is it's flexibility. It's not about having a big pass catcher, you have recievers for that. It's not about having a great blocker, you have linemen for that. It's about having a guy who can do both, allowing you to disguise the play better. Not only does it give you more options in playcalling, but it also forces the D to employ players that can both stop the run and cover.
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milanb
Joined: 04 Jan 2008
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Location: Ottawa, Ontario
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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I'm a huge Notre Dame fan, but this makes 4 Vikings starters from the Charlie Weiss era Irish teams. Not sure if that's a good thing.
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vike daddy
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2012 2:22 pm Post subject: |
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| milanb wrote: | | I'm a huge Notre Dame fan, but this makes 4 Vikings starters from the Charlie Weiss era Irish teams. Not sure if that's a good thing. |
in the linked article, Carlson talks about how he met his wife through John Sullivan's girlfriend at the time when both he and Sully were playing for ND.
the two gals both played on their volleyball team.
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Eric dunn
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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Location: San Antonio, TX
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:47 pm Post subject: |
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I think Carlson will be a nice addition to this team, but still dont like 5mil a year for him.
He has to stay healthy.
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Eric dunn wrote: | I think Carlson will be a nice addition to this team, but still dont like 5mil a year for him.
He has to stay healthy. |
$25M doesnt sound as bad it sounds.
Carlson's salary is $2.9 million in 2012 and 2013, in addition to a $5M signing bonus spread over five years and an annual $100,000 workout bonus. So for 2012 and 2013, he has a $4.0 million cap hit. 2014 his salary increases by $1M. In 2015 and 2016 his salary increases to $4.9 million.
What will be likely to happen is Carlson will either be cut in 2015, or restructure to stay with his home town team. By the time 2015 comes around, he will be over 30 yrs old.
So in reality, the deal is really a 3 year contract worth about $14.7. Doesnt sound as bad as 5 yrs/$25M. Its just back loaded fluff. |
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heydudemanG
Joined: 14 Mar 2007
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Location: Minneapolis
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:58 am Post subject: |
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| vikingsrule wrote: | | Eric dunn wrote: | I think Carlson will be a nice addition to this team, but still dont like 5mil a year for him.
He has to stay healthy. |
$25M doesnt sound as bad it sounds.
Carlson's salary is $2.9 million in 2012 and 2013, in addition to a $5M signing bonus spread over five years and an annual $100,000 workout bonus. So for 2012 and 2013, he has a $4.0 million cap hit. 2014 his salary increases by $1M. In 2015 and 2016 his salary increases to $4.9 million.
What will be likely to happen is Carlson will either be cut in 2015, or restructure to stay with his home town team. By the time 2015 comes around, he will be over 30 yrs old.
So in reality, the deal is really a 3 year contract worth about $14.7. Doesnt sound as bad as 5 yrs/$25M. Its just back loaded fluff. |
3 years for 15 million is the same as 5 million a year and 5 for 25. That is more than I'd want to pay for a tight end but if we saw what we saw in our guy who are we to judge. I like the extra element to the offense.
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:26 am Post subject: |
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^ Yes and no. You have to look at where the bulk of the money is coming from. He has a $5M guaranteed signing bonus, which is usually spread over the life of the contract in terms of the cap hit.
However, in 2015 and 2016, the base salary peaks where he is making an extra $2M per year compared to his salary in 2012 and 2013.
So in reality, contract length doesnt matter. He can be cut at anytime, and given he is already 28 yrs old, Carlson probably will be a Viking for 2-3 seasons and be forced to restructure or be cut. Hopefully by then Rhett Ellison will have emerged as a excellent blocker with sneaky good receiving skills, and hopefully by then Kyle Rudolph will be on his second all pro team selection. 
Carlson will essentially be making about $4M over the next two years. That really isnt terrible for a starters salary, that is about right for the free agent market. |
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