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Sllim Pickens
Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 17247
Location: Middle of the Mitten
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 Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | stylish313 wrote: | | LionsFTW wrote: | | When MJD signed his contract, he just started running the ball without Freddy Taylor. MJD was clearly in Freddy's shadow, and the contract shows that. MJD out produced that contract for 3 straight years by playing 3 years of consistent dominant football. |
MJD costing the Jags $8M per season doesn't show me he was in anybody's shadow. He has costed the Jags a cap hit of a top #5 running back, every year he has been on that contract; and will be still costing them what a top #5 RB would in each of his next two. |
... huh? Over his first three years in the league, he was Fred Jackson's backup. He then received a new contract (in 2009) and became the lead back (in 2009). He wasn't receiving "$8M per season" when Jackson was on the team.
It doesn't matter what MJD is costing the team. He was deserving of the bonus at the time. He is only GETTING PAID $4.5M right now. He is underpaid. |
But with the bonus his first year he was vastly overpaid, so it works itself out.
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LionsFTW
Joined: 25 Jan 2010
Posts: 17053
Location: Rock City, Arkansas
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| stylish313 wrote: | | LionsFTW wrote: | | When MJD signed his contract, he just started running the ball without Freddy Taylor. MJD was clearly in Freddy's shadow, and the contract shows that. MJD out produced that contract for 3 straight years by playing 3 years of consistent dominant football. |
MJD costing the Jags $8M per season doesn't show me he was in anybody's shadow. He has costed the Jags a cap hit of a top #5 running back, every year he has been on that contract; and will be still costing them what a top #5 RB would in each of his next two. |
His signing bonus was that of a top 5 RB. His yearly salary is not. Players don't care about the signing bonus. When their yearly salary is 4 M, and they are playing out or their minds every year, they get upset.
Signing bonus is a ploy to sign with us. It's a bonus. The bonus is Jacksonville's fault. It's basically a bribe to sign with us over another team. That has nothing to do with how much he is getting paid per season.... which is around 250,000 dollars a game. On par with some rookie salaries.
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TL-TwoWinsAway
Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Sllim Pickens wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | stylish313 wrote: | | LionsFTW wrote: | | When MJD signed his contract, he just started running the ball without Freddy Taylor. MJD was clearly in Freddy's shadow, and the contract shows that. MJD out produced that contract for 3 straight years by playing 3 years of consistent dominant football. |
MJD costing the Jags $8M per season doesn't show me he was in anybody's shadow. He has costed the Jags a cap hit of a top #5 running back, every year he has been on that contract; and will be still costing them what a top #5 RB would in each of his next two. |
... huh? Over his first three years in the league, he was Fred Jackson's backup. He then received a new contract (in 2009) and became the lead back (in 2009). He wasn't receiving "$8M per season" when Jackson was on the team.
It doesn't matter what MJD is costing the team. He was deserving of the bonus at the time. He is only GETTING PAID $4.5M right now. He is underpaid. |
But with the bonus his first year he was vastly overpaid, so it works itself out. |
No, he was rewarded for three years of being vastly underpaid.
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| kenney wrote: | | Stafford without Calvin Johnson is a mediocre QB |
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FootballPhreak
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 30713
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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| TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | Sllim Pickens wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | stylish313 wrote: | | LionsFTW wrote: | | When MJD signed his contract, he just started running the ball without Freddy Taylor. MJD was clearly in Freddy's shadow, and the contract shows that. MJD out produced that contract for 3 straight years by playing 3 years of consistent dominant football. |
MJD costing the Jags $8M per season doesn't show me he was in anybody's shadow. He has costed the Jags a cap hit of a top #5 running back, every year he has been on that contract; and will be still costing them what a top #5 RB would in each of his next two. |
... huh? Over his first three years in the league, he was Fred Jackson's backup. He then received a new contract (in 2009) and became the lead back (in 2009). He wasn't receiving "$8M per season" when Jackson was on the team.
It doesn't matter what MJD is costing the team. He was deserving of the bonus at the time. He is only GETTING PAID $4.5M right now. He is underpaid. |
But with the bonus his first year he was vastly overpaid, so it works itself out. |
No, he was rewarded for three years of being vastly underpaid. |
No moreso than the better RBs making more money than him.
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TL-TwoWinsAway
Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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| FootballPhreak wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | Sllim Pickens wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | stylish313 wrote: | | LionsFTW wrote: | | When MJD signed his contract, he just started running the ball without Freddy Taylor. MJD was clearly in Freddy's shadow, and the contract shows that. MJD out produced that contract for 3 straight years by playing 3 years of consistent dominant football. |
MJD costing the Jags $8M per season doesn't show me he was in anybody's shadow. He has costed the Jags a cap hit of a top #5 running back, every year he has been on that contract; and will be still costing them what a top #5 RB would in each of his next two. |
... huh? Over his first three years in the league, he was Fred Jackson's backup. He then received a new contract (in 2009) and became the lead back (in 2009). He wasn't receiving "$8M per season" when Jackson was on the team.
It doesn't matter what MJD is costing the team. He was deserving of the bonus at the time. He is only GETTING PAID $4.5M right now. He is underpaid. |
But with the bonus his first year he was vastly overpaid, so it works itself out. |
No, he was rewarded for three years of being vastly underpaid. |
No moreso than the better RBs making more money than him. |
I'm talking about his first three years in the league. He was a great player on the verge of breaking out, and was getting paid next-to-nothing. The bonus was a reward for his first three years in the league. His contract is now outdated, and doesn't match what he is.
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| kenney wrote: | | Stafford without Calvin Johnson is a mediocre QB |
- Said on 8/16/2012. |
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stylish313
Joined: 17 Jan 2009
Posts: 13773
Location: Flat Rock, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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| TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | FootballPhreak wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | Sllim Pickens wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | stylish313 wrote: | | LionsFTW wrote: | | When MJD signed his contract, he just started running the ball without Freddy Taylor. MJD was clearly in Freddy's shadow, and the contract shows that. MJD out produced that contract for 3 straight years by playing 3 years of consistent dominant football. |
MJD costing the Jags $8M per season doesn't show me he was in anybody's shadow. He has costed the Jags a cap hit of a top #5 running back, every year he has been on that contract; and will be still costing them what a top #5 RB would in each of his next two. |
... huh? Over his first three years in the league, he was Fred Jackson's backup. He then received a new contract (in 2009) and became the lead back (in 2009). He wasn't receiving "$8M per season" when Jackson was on the team.
It doesn't matter what MJD is costing the team. He was deserving of the bonus at the time. He is only GETTING PAID $4.5M right now. He is underpaid. |
But with the bonus his first year he was vastly overpaid, so it works itself out. |
No, he was rewarded for three years of being vastly underpaid. |
No moreso than the better RBs making more money than him. |
I'm talking about his first three years in the league. He was a great player on the verge of breaking out, and was getting paid next-to-nothing. The bonus was a reward for his first three years in the league. His contract is now outdated, and doesn't match what he is. |
I strongly disagree. His bonus was a reward for what the Jags thought he could be during the duration of his next contract. MJD was paid what he was worth as the 60th overall selection. Not the Jags fault that 59 teams didn't feel he was worth a first round contract.
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TL-TwoWinsAway
Joined: 19 Feb 2008
Posts: 24074
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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| stylish313 wrote: | | I strongly disagree. His bonus was a reward for what the Jags thought he could be during the duration of his next contract. MJD was paid what he was worth as the 60th overall selection. Not the Jags fault that 59 teams didn't feel he was worth a first round contract. |
I don't have a problem with his rookie contract. His next contract was his reward for being good. The bonus doesn't count against him now; it counted against him in 2009. It was a bonus.
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| kenney wrote: | | Stafford without Calvin Johnson is a mediocre QB |
- Said on 8/16/2012. |
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Sllim Pickens
Joined: 02 Jan 2007
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Location: Middle of the Mitten
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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MJD was a part time RB who took goal line carries his first three years. He scored a lot of TDs but didn't break 1000 yards until after he signed this contract. Getting 17 million for that is outrageous. The bonus is part of the next contract, not to compensate you for previous years. That's why it works out in the cap as it does. MJD took his big up front bonus and is using that to make it look like he is underpaid now. Which he likely is, but he still shouldn't hold out when he took that big bonus knowing he would be making only 4 mil this year and next.
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TL-TwoWinsAway
Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Sllim Pickens wrote: | | MJD was a part time RB who took goal line carries his first three years. He scored a lot of TDs but didn't break 1000 yards until after he signed this contract. |
Wow you're selling MJD's early years short:
2006: 166 carries, 941 yards, 5.7 average, 13 TDs
2007: 167 carries, 768 yards, 4.6 average, 9 TDs
2008: 197 carries, 824 yards, 4.2 average, 12 TDs
Those are great seasons, and he was making next-to-nothing.
| Sllim Pickens wrote: | | The bonus is part of the next contract, not to compensate you for previous years. That's why it works out in the cap as it does. MJD took his big up front bonus and is using that to make it look like he is underpaid now. Which he likely is, but he still shouldn't hold out when he took that big bonus knowing he would be making only 4 mil this year and next. |
It doesn't matter how it works out with the cap: the bonus was his reward in 2009. That has no bearing in 2012. If the team doesn't like that fact, they shouldn't offer bonuses.
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| kenney wrote: | | Stafford without Calvin Johnson is a mediocre QB |
- Said on 8/16/2012. |
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stylish313
Joined: 17 Jan 2009
Posts: 13773
Location: Flat Rock, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Sllim Pickens wrote: | | MJD was a part time RB who took goal line carries his first three years. He scored a lot of TDs but didn't break 1000 yards until after he signed this contract. Getting 17 million for that is outrageous. The bonus is part of the next contract, not to compensate you for previous years. That's why it works out in the cap as it does. MJD took his big up front bonus and is using that to make it look like he is underpaid now. Which he likely is, but he still shouldn't hold out when he took that big bonus knowing he would be making only 4 mil this year and next. |
Yep. Plus, if the Jags were any good and were up against the cap as the Lions are, then that bonus would most definitely come into play. Teams use those signing bonuses as means of beating the cap, so many players sign for lower base salaries and huge signing bonuses in order to help the team stay under the cap.
And to FTW, why the hell would players not want a huge signing bonus, and rather higher yearly salaries??? If you know anything about economics, you'd know that getting your money now and investing it is a much better financial plan than annuitizing your payments throughout the years.
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FootballPhreak
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 30713
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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| TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | FootballPhreak wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | Sllim Pickens wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | stylish313 wrote: | | LionsFTW wrote: | | When MJD signed his contract, he just started running the ball without Freddy Taylor. MJD was clearly in Freddy's shadow, and the contract shows that. MJD out produced that contract for 3 straight years by playing 3 years of consistent dominant football. |
MJD costing the Jags $8M per season doesn't show me he was in anybody's shadow. He has costed the Jags a cap hit of a top #5 running back, every year he has been on that contract; and will be still costing them what a top #5 RB would in each of his next two. |
... huh? Over his first three years in the league, he was Fred Jackson's backup. He then received a new contract (in 2009) and became the lead back (in 2009). He wasn't receiving "$8M per season" when Jackson was on the team.
It doesn't matter what MJD is costing the team. He was deserving of the bonus at the time. He is only GETTING PAID $4.5M right now. He is underpaid. |
But with the bonus his first year he was vastly overpaid, so it works itself out. |
No, he was rewarded for three years of being vastly underpaid. |
No moreso than the better RBs making more money than him. |
I'm talking about his first three years in the league. He was a great player on the verge of breaking out, and was getting paid next-to-nothing. The bonus was a reward for his first three years in the league. His contract is now outdated, and doesn't match what he is. |
And I am talking about those better RBs first 3 and even 4 years in some cases.
His contract is right in line with what he deserves. I can't believe you are all over paying a top 5 RB #1 in the NFL money, but can't swallow paying a young up and coming top 15 DE Top 10 money 
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| Draft_FanAddict wrote: | | If that doesn't concern you, I don't know what would...a missing head? |
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TL-TwoWinsAway
Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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| FootballPhreak wrote: | | His contract is right in line with what he deserves. I can't believe you are all over paying a top 5 RB #1 in the NFL money, but can't swallow paying a young up and coming top 15 DE Top 10 money |
MJD is an unquestionably better RB than Avril is DE. MJD deserves to be paid (not capped; paid) like a top 5 NFL RB. Avril does not deserve top 10 DE money.
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| kenney wrote: | | Stafford without Calvin Johnson is a mediocre QB |
- Said on 8/16/2012. |
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FootballPhreak
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 30713
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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| TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | FootballPhreak wrote: | | His contract is right in line with what he deserves. I can't believe you are all over paying a top 5 RB #1 in the NFL money, but can't swallow paying a young up and coming top 15 DE Top 10 money |
MJD is an unquestionably better RB than Avril is DE. MJD deserves to be paid (not capped; paid) like a top 5 NFL RB. Avril does not deserve top 10 DE money. |
MJD IS paid like a top 5 RB, HE WANTS MORE
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| Draft_FanAddict wrote: | | If that doesn't concern you, I don't know what would...a missing head? |
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stylish313
Joined: 17 Jan 2009
Posts: 13773
Location: Flat Rock, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:56 pm Post subject: |
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| TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | FootballPhreak wrote: | | His contract is right in line with what he deserves. I can't believe you are all over paying a top 5 RB #1 in the NFL money, but can't swallow paying a young up and coming top 15 DE Top 10 money |
MJD is an unquestionably better RB than Avril is DE. MJD deserves to be paid (not capped; paid) like a top 5 NFL RB. Avril does not deserve top 10 DE money. |
So you'd be fine paying Avril 5 years, $25M, with a $30 singing bonus, since he'd be paid as a top #15 DE instead of top #10???
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Last edited by stylish313 on Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:59 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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TL-TwoWinsAway
Joined: 19 Feb 2008
Posts: 24074
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| stylish313 wrote: | | TL-TwoWinsAway wrote: | | FootballPhreak wrote: | | His contract is right in line with what he deserves. I can't believe you are all over paying a top 5 RB #1 in the NFL money, but can't swallow paying a young up and coming top 15 DE Top 10 money |
MJD is an unquestionably better RB than Avril is DE. MJD deserves to be paid (not capped; paid) like a top 5 NFL RB. Avril does not deserve top 10 DE money. |
So you'd be fine paying Avril 5 years, $25M, with a $30 singing bonus, since he'd be paid as a top #40 DE instead of top #10??? |
No, I wouldn't be fine with paying Avril a big singing bonus in the first place because I'm not an idiot.
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| kenney wrote: | | Stafford without Calvin Johnson is a mediocre QB |
- Said on 8/16/2012. |
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