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Django
Joined: 03 May 2012
Posts: 1482
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 Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:10 am Post subject: The Howard Mudd/Vick dynamic |
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Honestly, I think the Eagles made a mistake TWO years ago. No no no, not the Vick contract. Which in hindsight is a mistake.
But in all honesty, when they moved Juan from OLine coach and brought in Howard Mudd.
The Mudd experiment has been atrocious. Vick got sacked more under Juan's Oline, but it was clear it was because he held the ball to long. These Olineman now are just weak. Mudd's system makes things more complicated for a QB who likes things less complex.
Im not saying Mudd is a bad oline coach. Im just saying his philosophy is a terrible fit for a QB like Vick. Quick throws, a cerebral QB....they fit Mudd's system better. Marty calls plays that fits Vick's strength, but the Oline isnt built to protect him on those plays.
Get a cerebral QB in there and the Oline wont look bad. If Vick somehow survives the season, gets to the playoffs. I'd still get rid of Mudd if they are intent on bringing Vick back. |
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PowerElite
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Posts: 7630
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:22 am Post subject: |
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The problem is that Mudd's lines have always given up big time sack totals before Peyton Manning made him look good. I made a thread on this which is now locked.
| Quote: | San Diego Chargers (1974–1976) 23, 50, 46
San Francisco 49ers (1977) 36
Seattle Seahawks (1978–1982) 44, 23, 51, 37, 36
Cleveland Browns (1983–1988) 33, 55, 36, 39, 29, 36
Kansas City Chiefs (1989–1992) 23, 22, 21, 48
Seattle Seahawks (1993–1997) 48, 40, 45, 38, 36
Those are the sack totals during the years he coached with those teams. |
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=459788&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
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RainbowCarebear
Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 22702
Location: Avenging his brother by slaying three of Prince Rhaegar's bannermen and later Rodrik Greyjoy
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:22 am Post subject: |
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Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul.
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"Of gold and silver and gemstones, it had none; bronze and iron were the metals of winter"
"He is part of you, Robb. To fear him is to fear you."
"These are northmen, Uncle. The north remembers." |
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Django
Joined: 03 May 2012
Posts: 1482
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:25 am Post subject: |
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| PowerElite wrote: | The problem is that Mudd's lines have always given up big time sack totals before Peyton Manning made him look good. I made a thread on this which is now locked.
| Quote: | San Diego Chargers (1974–1976) 23, 50, 46
San Francisco 49ers (1977) 36
Seattle Seahawks (1978–1982) 44, 23, 51, 37, 36
Cleveland Browns (1983–1988) 33, 55, 36, 39, 29, 36
Kansas City Chiefs (1989–1992) 23, 22, 21, 48
Seattle Seahawks (1993–1997) 48, 40, 45, 38, 36
Those are the sack totals during the years he coached with those teams. |
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=459788&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
Ouch. I guess this points to the greatest of Peyton Manning. |
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Remixxxxxxx
Joined: 06 Mar 2009
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Location: E808 on the avi; P90 on the sig
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:28 am Post subject: |
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| RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul. |
and they both have done more bad then good here.
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Django
Joined: 03 May 2012
Posts: 1482
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:33 am Post subject: |
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| Remixxxxxxx wrote: | | RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul. |
and they both have done more bad then good here. |
Boy...just bad decisions all way around in 2011...that still are hurting the Eagles now...
Cant protect the QB, cant sack the QB.  |
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RainbowCarebear
Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 22702
Location: Avenging his brother by slaying three of Prince Rhaegar's bannermen and later Rodrik Greyjoy
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| Remixxxxxxx wrote: | | RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul. |
and they both have done more bad then good here. |
Added some talented players, but that could've been in a different system.
I have nothing against Mudd and Washburn, my hatred go further up.
_________________
"Of gold and silver and gemstones, it had none; bronze and iron were the metals of winter"
"He is part of you, Robb. To fear him is to fear you."
"These are northmen, Uncle. The north remembers." |
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Remixxxxxxx
Joined: 06 Mar 2009
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Location: E808 on the avi; P90 on the sig
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:43 am Post subject: |
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| RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Remixxxxxxx wrote: | | RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul. |
and they both have done more bad then good here. |
Added some talented players, but that could've been in a different system.
I have nothing against Mudd and Washburn, my hatred go further up. |
Well obviously there's other issues to be layed out, but these two guys have brought nothing to our team. I was under the impression that Washburn would have our dudes getting 3-5 sacks per game and that Mudd would be protecting Michael Vick flawlessly.
It's time for everyone to go, starting with Reid and including everyone on the staff, aside from Bowles.
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McNabbMcFadden
Joined: 25 Feb 2007
Posts: 29213
Location: State College, PA
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Remixxxxxxx wrote: | | RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul. |
and they both have done more bad then good here. |
QFTMFT
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Pink it is |
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marky_b27
Joined: 16 Mar 2007
Posts: 17010
Location: Nottingham, England
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Remixxxxxxx wrote: | | RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul. |
and they both have done more bad then good here. |
Damn straight!
Problem is Reid wasn't going to move juan to dc unless he got a 'good' o line coach, so that's why we got a mudd Washburn combo
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| oland11 on America's use of Fahrenheit wrote: | | I know. We're stupid. |
| RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Again bloody fool him Howie. |
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marky_b27
Joined: 16 Mar 2007
Posts: 17010
Location: Nottingham, England
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Django wrote: | | Remixxxxxxx wrote: | | RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Mudd & Washburn is a team. But I still would prefer a complete overhaul. |
and they both have done more bad then good here. |
Boy...just bad decisions all way around in 2011...that still are hurting the Eagles now...
Cant protect the QB, cant sack the QB. |
Trying to build the dream team without any dynamics or chemistry
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| oland11 on America's use of Fahrenheit wrote: | | I know. We're stupid. |
| RainbowCarebear wrote: | | Again bloody fool him Howie. |
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nlesthought
Joined: 21 Feb 2007
Posts: 7617
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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My frustrated self says everyone must go, EVERYONE.
My realistic self says that's not possible until we see an utter failure. Meaning no playoffs and complete mayhem within the lockerroom.
My defiant self says put Foles in there he has 12 days to prepare, lets see what he can do either A I will be right all along and the Offense is too predictable and AR is getting out coached or B we can can salvage the season hopefully and make a mini-run.
On the topic...
I can't blame Mudd for these guys having no sense of awareness simple stunts, delayed blitzes and of course better DL play is the reason Vick is getting crushed. We all know this isn't a quick passing attack we use.
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| Phire wrote: | | Brady, Rodgers, or Manning will win this Super Bowl. |
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Phire
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 39245
Location: #championchip 2012 HoF
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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A) If we didn't lose 40% of our line we're having a different discussion
B) Washburn's wide-9 has flaws but our defense has greatly improved since he's gotten here
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Remixxxxxxx
Joined: 06 Mar 2009
Posts: 9945
Location: E808 on the avi; P90 on the sig
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | A) If we didn't lose 40% of our line we're having a different discussion |
I do agree with this, but it's not like Bell was even half this bad last year in Buffalo, and the offensive lineman[Watkins] he "picked out" is an absolute bum. The system does not work, it's not working now, it didn't work last year, we just were able to mask it behind JPs play.
| Quote: | | B) Washburn's wide-9 has flaws but our defense has greatly improved since he's gotten here |
I don't think the defensive line[his job] has gotten any better since he's been here. I actually believe they've gotten progressively worse since his arrival. The defense is playing better because we actually have real linebackers, playing in the correct spots, and our team tackling is much better.
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RainbowCarebear
Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 22702
Location: Avenging his brother by slaying three of Prince Rhaegar's bannermen and later Rodrik Greyjoy
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| Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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Would rather save Foles. Let Vick take the beating and cut him in the off season.
Also right now Andy believes we have the best chance of winning with Vick, and I can't fault him there. Not with this Oline.
_________________
"Of gold and silver and gemstones, it had none; bronze and iron were the metals of winter"
"He is part of you, Robb. To fear him is to fear you."
"These are northmen, Uncle. The north remembers." |
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