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Gameday Thread Week 6: DEN (2-3) @ SD (3-2)
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PGeorge2


Joined: 20 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
Logic here is, if Houston wouldn't have wreck our defense, the game would have been closer. Seems legit.


No, the logic is, if we played Houtson 20 more times, they wouldn't score 3 60+ yard TDs. Which, in essence, would make it harder for them to score and thus making the game closer. Follow?

Are you really arguing that if we played Houtson again this week they would do the same exact thing?
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big_palooka


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Russell2Bailey wrote:
Funny, I didn't know coming close to a 4th quarter comeback and just barely getting it gets classified as "Garbage Time." How comical.


It's a comedy of errors if you are talking about the NE game. Pats go for a ridiculous 4th down that fails and their next possession Ridley coughs up the ball.

They punt on that 4th down and it's a different story. Ridley doesn't fumble it's a different story.

The Pats gave up 14 point in that sequence. That won't always happen. If not for those 2 mistakes (granted they were made, but that an exception not a rule) the Broncos would never come close to anything. They were absolutely worked for 60 minutes.
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big_palooka


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PGeorge2 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
Logic here is, if Houston wouldn't have wreck our defense, the game would have been closer. Seems legit.


No, the logic is, if we played Houtson 20 more times, they wouldn't score 3 60+ yard TDs. Which, in essence, would make it harder for them to score and thus making the game closer. Follow?

Are you really arguing that if we played Houtson again this week they would do the same exact thing?


No. But I will argue that while they might not hit those chunk plays, they will still execute their offense and put points on the board. Just because they hit those 3 long plays doesn't mean they couldn't have just continued the drive and scored anyway.
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broncos67


Joined: 28 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
Russell2Bailey wrote:
Funny, I didn't know coming close to a 4th quarter comeback and just barely getting it gets classified as "Garbage Time." How comical.


It's a comedy of errors if you are talking about the NE game. Pats go for a ridiculous 4th down that fails and their next possession Ridley coughs up the ball.

They punt on that 4th down and it's a different story. Ridley doesn't fumble it's a different story.

The Pats gave up 14 point in that sequence. That won't always happen. If not for those 2 mistakes (granted they were made, but that an exception not a rule) the Broncos would never come close to anything. They were absolutely worked for 60 minutes.


I can play that game too palooka. If Thomas doesn't fumble on the first drive of the game when we were in position to at least score three points, if McGahee doesn't drop the easiest 4th down conversion ever which would have put us very close to Prater's range and if McGahee doesn't fumble at the end of the game it's a different story.

That's the way it goes. NE took the chance, and we scored 14 quick points. You can't play the what if game.

FWIW, I consider garbage time to be a time when stats are racked up when the game is 100% out of reach. Garbage time does NOT start with 10 minutes left in 3Q. If a team has a chance to stop the defense, get the ball back and take a lead, that's on the other team not stepping on the gas enough.
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PGeorge2


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
Just because they hit those 3 long plays doesn't mean they couldn't have just continued the drive and scored anyway.


And it doesn't mean they would have either.
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Cutler06


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:

As for Denver, didn't NE just get done running down their throats for 60 minutes? While Matthews isn't some elite stud, he's on the same level of the RBs that got a taste last week of that Denver defense.


While I think Mathews is a better back than what NE has, you're conviently overlooking two things:

1. NE has a MUCH better offensive line than SD does

2. NE was way ahead when they started running it down our throats, something I don't see happening this week.
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KC's pass rush is fast. Manning's decision making is faster.
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Cutler06


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:

The Raiders are a mess. There is no way SD is on their level. The Raiders are a 2-3 year reclamation project right now.


Is THAT why you're over here so much, to see what fans of a REAL team talk about ??

And 2-3 years, did we hear that same thing ...about a DECADE AGO Laughing Laughing
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KC's pass rush is fast. Manning's decision making is faster.
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big_palooka


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cutler06 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:

The Raiders are a mess. There is no way SD is on their level. The Raiders are a 2-3 year reclamation project right now.


Is THAT why you're over here so much, to see what fans of a REAL team talk about ??

And 2-3 years, did we hear that same thing ...about a DECADE AGO Laughing Laughing


First Denver is a pretender. They are not making the playoffs, just like the Raiders.

And no, I've been ready for a rebuild forever. Davis trading high draft picks over the years and reaching on projects left Oakland with a roster of talentless athletes. No great football payers. Time to gut it and build it through the draft. Not with the Seymour's of the world who offer 3 seasons at best.
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BroncoinGermany


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
Cutler06 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:

The Raiders are a mess. There is no way SD is on their level. The Raiders are a 2-3 year reclamation project right now.


Is THAT why you're over here so much, to see what fans of a REAL team talk about ??

And 2-3 years, did we hear that same thing ...about a DECADE AGO Laughing Laughing


First Denver is a pretender. They are not making the playoffs, just like the Raiders.

And no, I've been ready for a rebuild forever. Davis trading high draft picks over the years and reaching on projects left Oakland with a roster of talentless athletes. No great football payers. Time to gut it and build it through the draft. Not with the Seymour's of the world who offer 3 seasons at best.


You can make a case for that if we lose Monday night. Until then, I pretend like I didn't read your post.
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broncosfan07


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BroncoinGermany wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
Cutler06 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:

The Raiders are a mess. There is no way SD is on their level. The Raiders are a 2-3 year reclamation project right now.


Is THAT why you're over here so much, to see what fans of a REAL team talk about ??

And 2-3 years, did we hear that same thing ...about a DECADE AGO Laughing Laughing


First Denver is a pretender. They are not making the playoffs, just like the Raiders.

And no, I've been ready for a rebuild forever. Davis trading high draft picks over the years and reaching on projects left Oakland with a roster of talentless athletes. No great football payers. Time to gut it and build it through the draft. Not with the Seymour's of the world who offer 3 seasons at best.


You can make a case for that if we lose Monday night. Until then, I pretend like I didn't read your post.
Just ignore him, he stated Denver would win the AFC West before too.
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BroncoinGermany


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

broncosfan07 wrote:
BroncoinGermany wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
Cutler06 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:

The Raiders are a mess. There is no way SD is on their level. The Raiders are a 2-3 year reclamation project right now.


Is THAT why you're over here so much, to see what fans of a REAL team talk about ??

And 2-3 years, did we hear that same thing ...about a DECADE AGO Laughing Laughing


First Denver is a pretender. They are not making the playoffs, just like the Raiders.

And no, I've been ready for a rebuild forever. Davis trading high draft picks over the years and reaching on projects left Oakland with a roster of talentless athletes. No great football payers. Time to gut it and build it through the draft. Not with the Seymour's of the world who offer 3 seasons at best.


You can make a case for that if we lose Monday night. Until then, I pretend like I didn't read your post.
Just ignore him, he stated Denver would win the AFC West before too.


Oh, I know his ways. Nonetheless, if we lose to SD, we need to readjust our season outlook. So in that sense he might be right.
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paul-mac


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
Cutler06 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:

The Raiders are a mess. There is no way SD is on their level. The Raiders are a 2-3 year reclamation project right now.


Is THAT why you're over here so much, to see what fans of a REAL team talk about ??

And 2-3 years, did we hear that same thing ...about a DECADE AGO Laughing Laughing


First Denver is a pretender. They are not making the playoffs, just like the Raiders.

And no, I've been ready for a rebuild forever. Davis trading high draft picks over the years and reaching on projects left Oakland with a roster of talentless athletes. No great football payers. Time to gut it and build it through the draft. Not with the Seymour's of the world who offer 3 seasons at best.



You just can't say that so categorically. We're in a 50/50 race for the division with SD and even then, AFC West runner up might well get in as a wildcard.
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PackAtBroncos07


Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
Cutler06 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:

The Raiders are a mess. There is no way SD is on their level. The Raiders are a 2-3 year reclamation project right now.


Is THAT why you're over here so much, to see what fans of a REAL team talk about ??

And 2-3 years, did we hear that same thing ...about a DECADE AGO Laughing Laughing


First Denver is a pretender. They are not making the playoffs, just like the Raiders.

And no, I've been ready for a rebuild forever. Davis trading high draft picks over the years and reaching on projects left Oakland with a roster of talentless athletes. No great football payers. Time to gut it and build it through the draft. Not with the Seymour's of the world who offer 3 seasons at best.


Lose your tune on Denver and I think you've finally got a grip on reality.
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DILinator


Joined: 20 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off, at what point does this Raider fan invading a Broncos gameday thread just to insult and degrade the other team without any real points to make become trolling? I mean, come on Pooki! You have your own forum, and gameday thread, and you need to go back there and stay out of here! If the Chargers fans were in here talking smack it would at least be understandable and justifiable, but what you're doing is pure, 100% trollish, nonesense!

Secondly, Denver is BY FAR the most deceivingly 2-3 team in the league. They have lost to Atlanta, Houston, and New England, easily three of the top four teams in the league. What's more, they didn't get blown out, and mounted furious comebacks that came close to getting them back in the win column. Their defense has been average, at best this year, so I won't argue with any statements stating the Broncos DEFENSE is average and nothing special. But their offense, minus the turnovers, has looked DYNAMIC, most of the season. Peyton really only struggled in that Atlanta game, and if Thomas and McGahee can cure their fumbilitis, then Denver's going to put up serious points on anybody in the league.

It's easy to say my evaluation of the Broncos is driven by "homerism", but the fact of the matter is that sound analysis of the Broncos' season by any neutral commentator, would turn up the same results. Once the schedule lightens up (starting after the BYE), Denver will be going on a serious run, mark my words.

As for this week's game, I am not as emphatic about the outcome as some of you fellow Broncos fans, but I do believe we SHOULD win this game, based on what I've seen from both teams so far. I do think it will be a relatively close game, as San Diego isn't terrible, and it is a divisional road game. Still, Manning has looked awesome more often than not this season, and the Chargers compare more to a team like the the Steelers than to the three teams the Broncos have lost to...
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ToastedOats


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
broncos67 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
broncos67 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
broncos67 wrote:
I'm not 100% confident that we win this, but SD is NOT a good football team, IMO. They have played a fairly weak schedule to this point, got beat by a very bad Saints team, and got trounced by ATL.

I don't see much in terms of weapons on their offense (except obviously Gates, but he's having a down season), and their defense is improving but doesn't truly scare me.

That being said, it's a division game away and anything can happen. Denver is playing a crucial game though, and after last week I think they come out fired up.

Denver 24
San Diego 20


Think you are selling the Saints short. It was only a matter of time before they started clicking on offense. Brees is after all a top 5 QB in this game and he put on a show.

I would worry about the Denver defense. Norv will pull a page out of NE's play book and get Matthews/Battle running early and set up his passing game. Rivers is capable of picking apart the defense. Matthews and Floyd I predict to have a nice day.


To be fair palooka, SDs defense has not been that great this year, and the Saints were bound to take advantage of a bad defense at some point. The Saints have a very good offense, but they cannot make it work effectively without Payton. Most of the games the Saints lost or played poorly in is because they aren't utilizing talent properly and they look lost half the time. I don't see that changing soon.

Denver's defense can be exposed but SD doesn't have NEAR the talent NE does. We actually played well defensively against ATL, the turnovers are what killed us. Matthews is overrated. NOs run defense is the worst in the league, IIRC. I think we'l stop him, I'm just worried about Gates. I don't see SDs receivers doing much, and Floyd is their only weapon on that front.


Ingrams personal foul on Brees negated a pick 6 or that game was over.

As for Denver, didn't NE just get done running down their throats for 60 minutes? While Matthews isn't some elite stud, he's on the same level of the RBs that got a taste last week of that Denver defense.

SD and Denver are both average teams right now. Denver was worked up and down the field by NE last week. Against Atlanta, they were in a big hole as well. The Steelers game was their most complete. More run and Manning not throwing it 50 times.


NE ran down their throat because they were able to force Denver into using nickel and dime defenses without substitutions. The team was clearly gassed and couldn't deal with the rapid fire NE offense.

SD does not have those kind of weapons, nor are they going to be able to run the sort of offense that NE does. Before that game, Denver had more than adequately stopped Turner, Foster, and McFadden. I'm not worried against Denver's run D in the least.


Turner is a worn down back and Atlanta just took to whipping Denver in the passing game. The Raiders can't block the run to save their lives, so that's not a feat. Stopped Foster? He average 4.2 YPC setting up their play action offense that torched Denver's secondary repeatedly.

I'm not saying Denver can't stifle SD's offense and win this game. I am just saying people thinking Denver is going to blow them out and SD is only going to score 10 points. That's just dumb. They are an average team playing a similar team. It's not Denver vs. Jacksonville, Oakland or Tennessee.


BP,

Let's review the games.
Pitt - Denver looked good, not great and beat a team missing starters. Pittsburgh held the ball the entire third quarter and Denver still won by 10+ points.
Atl - Denver had threw turnovers in the first four series which lead to the difference in the game. Atl did not throw all over the field, it was field position that killed Denver.
Houston - Tracy Porter was exposed in coverage and in tackling and Denver still had a chance to win the game. Thomas begins to fumble. If he does not turn the ball over inside the 20 maybe Denver wins.
Oak - Denver's most complete game.
N.E. - There are five plays that killed Denver. #1 - Thomas fumbles inside the 20. #2 - Denver allows a third and 14 run of 16 yards which keeps a drive alive and N.E. scores. #3 - Denver allows a run of 19 yards on third and 17, which keeps a drive alive and N.E. scores. #4 - McGahee drops a pass which would have resulted in a first down and maybe Denver scores. #5 - McGahee fumbles inside the 20 ending any chance of a comeback.

So your argument is full of holes. Denver is beating itself with turnovers and unsound play at the most inopportune times in games. I still think Denver goes 10-6 as there will be more games in which they do not execute as well as they should. I think 10-6 wins the AFC West and Denver goes to the AFC Championship game and beats the Texans to advance to the Super Bowl.
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