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Jason Avant 2 TDs In Last 37 Games, NFL Record for Futility?
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 9094
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
He isnt a redzone threat, he is a guy that moves the chains...


He's 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions. Shocked
If his job is to move the chains he isn't doing a good job.


one hes not great at getting 1st down....hes a great on 3rd down getting a first down.

two how many of the 63 people ahead of him are 3rd string wrs or lower?
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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BLick12


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TommyC376 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
Tzimisce wrote:
Mossburg wrote:
So I'm confused here.

Does Avant not get open?

Does he drop passes a lot?

What exactly is the problem here, just the fact that he doesn't catch TDs?
He's thrown 14 of 16 passes thrown to him this year. 2nd best percentage among WRs to Randall Cobb [22 of 25]. As a possession/3rd down receiver, he's one of the better ones in the league.


That's a weak stat for an offense that's 31st in the entire NFL in points per game. When you have a guy that has only scored 2TDs in his last 37 games while currently 63rd in 1st down receptions this season, he obviously is a major contributor to that paltry performance. But "he is just doing his job." Laughing 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions on the 2nd to worst scoring offense in the NFL. BTW Damaris Johnson was leading Avant in 1st down receptions after starting the Cardinals game. Damaris hasn't received much playing time after starting that game...
Hey PE ... Not an Eagles fan, but I know that Avant is the 5th-6th opiton in the offense, the reason he is 63rd in 1st downs is because he only has 16 targets. Lol only 4 of the passes he has caught DIDNT go for first downs. Your hatred for Avant is silly. He is a decent player with good hands who is willing to get dirty ie block LBs go over the middle, and still catches 1st downs.


Exactly, and when Demaris Johnson play this year he played in place of Maclin. Johnson is like 5'0 he would get murdered going over the middle. The degree of difficulty on a vast majority of Avan'ts catches is very high, he is usually getting led into a defender or catching the ball in a ton of traffic. A lot of what he does doesn't show up in a stat sheet. He opens things up in the middle and against the Giants they were using him in tight to chip on JPP and Tuck, that is something a 160 pound receiver like Johnson can't do.
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Another Ginger QB in the AFC North.

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PowerElite


Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Posts: 8808
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TommyC376 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
Tzimisce wrote:
Mossburg wrote:
So I'm confused here.

Does Avant not get open?

Does he drop passes a lot?

What exactly is the problem here, just the fact that he doesn't catch TDs?
He's thrown 14 of 16 passes thrown to him this year. 2nd best percentage among WRs to Randall Cobb [22 of 25]. As a possession/3rd down receiver, he's one of the better ones in the league.


That's a weak stat for an offense that's 31st in the entire NFL in points per game. When you have a guy that has only scored 2TDs in his last 37 games while currently 63rd in 1st down receptions this season, he obviously is a major contributor to that paltry performance. But "he is just doing his job." Laughing 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions on the 2nd to worst scoring offense in the NFL. BTW Damaris Johnson was leading Avant in 1st down receptions after starting the Cardinals game. Damaris hasn't received much playing time after starting that game...
Hey PE ... Not an Eagles fan, but I know that Avant is the 5th-6th opiton in the offense, the reason he is 63rd in 1st downs is because he only has 16 targets. Lol only 4 of the passes he has caught DIDNT go for first downs. Your hatred for Avant is silly. He is a decent player with good hands who is willing to get dirty ie block LBs go over the middle, and still catches 1st downs.


I don't know how much you know about football but you don't get targeted much WHEN YOU ARE RARELY OPEN AND POOR AT CREATING SEPARATION! There is nothing but a lack of talent that is prevention Avant from getting nmore targets in the 31st worst scoring offense in the NFL. You make it sound like other players are taking his opportunities away while he is wide open. Laughing Are Desean and Maclin amongst the top receivers this year while Avant is wide open?
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TommyC376


Joined: 08 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

eagles101 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
He isnt a redzone threat, he is a guy that moves the chains...


He's 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions. Shocked
If his job is to move the chains he isn't doing a good job.


one hes not great at getting 1st down....hes a great on 3rd down getting a first down.

two how many of the 63 people ahead of him are 3rd string wrs or lower?
He cant move up the list if he only has 16 targets this season. Look at the ration he has 14 catches and 10 of them are first downs. I want to where is ranks in 1st down percentage.
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PowerElite


Joined: 25 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TommyC376 wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
He isnt a redzone threat, he is a guy that moves the chains...


He's 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions. Shocked
If his job is to move the chains he isn't doing a good job.


one hes not great at getting 1st down....hes a great on 3rd down getting a first down.

two how many of the 63 people ahead of him are 3rd string wrs or lower?
He cant move up the list if he only has 16 targets this season. Look at the ration he has 14 catches and 10 of them are first downs. I want to where is ranks in 1st down percentage.


Very Happy
PowerElite wrote:

I don't know how much you know about football but you don't get targeted much WHEN YOU ARE RARELY OPEN AND POOR AT CREATING SEPARATION! There is nothing but a lack of talent that is prevention Avant from getting nmore targets in the 31st worst scoring offense in the NFL. You make it sound like other players are taking his opportunities away while he is wide open. Laughing Are Desean and Maclin amongst the top receivers this year while Avant is wide open?
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TommyC376


Joined: 08 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
TommyC376 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
Tzimisce wrote:
Mossburg wrote:
So I'm confused here.

Does Avant not get open?

Does he drop passes a lot?

What exactly is the problem here, just the fact that he doesn't catch TDs?
He's thrown 14 of 16 passes thrown to him this year. 2nd best percentage among WRs to Randall Cobb [22 of 25]. As a possession/3rd down receiver, he's one of the better ones in the league.


That's a weak stat for an offense that's 31st in the entire NFL in points per game. When you have a guy that has only scored 2TDs in his last 37 games while currently 63rd in 1st down receptions this season, he obviously is a major contributor to that paltry performance. But "he is just doing his job." Laughing 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions on the 2nd to worst scoring offense in the NFL. BTW Damaris Johnson was leading Avant in 1st down receptions after starting the Cardinals game. Damaris hasn't received much playing time after starting that game...
Hey PE ... Not an Eagles fan, but I know that Avant is the 5th-6th opiton in the offense, the reason he is 63rd in 1st downs is because he only has 16 targets. Lol only 4 of the passes he has caught DIDNT go for first downs. Your hatred for Avant is silly. He is a decent player with good hands who is willing to get dirty ie block LBs go over the middle, and still catches 1st downs.


I don't know how much you know about football but you don't get targeted much WHEN YOU ARE RARELY OPEN AND POOR AT CREATING SEPARATION! There is nothing but a lack of talent that is prevention Avant from getting nmore targets in the 31st worst scoring offense in the NFL. You make it sound like other players are taking his opportunities away while he is wide open. Laughing Are Desean and Maclin amongst the top receivers this year while Avant is wide open?
Like I said he is 5th - 6th option in your offense. Jackson, Maclin, Celek, McCoy and even the undrafted rookie D. Johnson will get looks over him. All I am saying is your mad for no reason, if your O sucks as bad as you say it does then look at the playmakers like Jackson, McCoy, Maclin and Celek. Not the slot WR who is asked to make 3rd down to 1st down catches.
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 9094
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TommyC376 wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
He isnt a redzone threat, he is a guy that moves the chains...


He's 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions. Shocked
If his job is to move the chains he isn't doing a good job.


one hes not great at getting 1st down....hes a great on 3rd down getting a first down.

two how many of the 63 people ahead of him are 3rd string wrs or lower?
He cant move up the list if he only has 16 targets this season. Look at the ration he has 14 catches and 10 of them are first downs. I want to where is ranks in 1st down percentage.


o i know. what im saying is that there are a lot of players that get first downs on first or second down. avant gets his on 3rd down. thats why i asked how many of them were actually 3rd string and not just main players getting first downs.
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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TommyC376


Joined: 08 Feb 2008
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Location: Capital Wasteland
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

eagles101 wrote:
TommyC376 wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
He isnt a redzone threat, he is a guy that moves the chains...


He's 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions. Shocked
If his job is to move the chains he isn't doing a good job.


one hes not great at getting 1st down....hes a great on 3rd down getting a first down.

two how many of the 63 people ahead of him are 3rd string wrs or lower?
He cant move up the list if he only has 16 targets this season. Look at the ration he has 14 catches and 10 of them are first downs. I want to where is ranks in 1st down percentage.


o i know. what im saying is that there are a lot of players that get first downs on first or second down. avant gets his on 3rd down. thats why i asked how many of them were actually 3rd string and not just main players getting first downs.
Agreed. Avant is always getting the job done on 3rd down. He is pretty clutch. In terms of getting the job done on 3rd down.
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PowerElite


Joined: 25 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TommyC376 wrote:
Like I said he is 5th - 6th option in your offense. Jackson, Maclin, Celek, McCoy and even the undrafted rookie D. Johnson will get looks over him. All I am saying is your mad for no reason, if your O sucks as bad as you say it does then look at the playmakers like Jackson, McCoy, Maclin and Celek. Not the slot WR who is asked to make 3rd down to 1st down catches.


Victor Cruz is a slot receiver and a playmaker, so is Percy Harvin. No one asks a slot receiver to never get open and be poor at YAC and scoring TDs. Laughing
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w4rrior723


Joined: 27 Dec 2006
Posts: 5133
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
Poster4613 wrote:
I was under the impression Jason Avant was one of the best #3 WR's in the NFL. Did something change?


People are lied to by the media all of the time, but numbers don't lie. I provided numbers so everyone can make their own objective determination.


I'm not sure, but I think he was being sarcastic, brah.
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BLick12


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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Location: South Jeezy fo sheezy
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
TommyC376 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
Tzimisce wrote:
Mossburg wrote:
So I'm confused here.

Does Avant not get open?

Does he drop passes a lot?

What exactly is the problem here, just the fact that he doesn't catch TDs?
He's thrown 14 of 16 passes thrown to him this year. 2nd best percentage among WRs to Randall Cobb [22 of 25]. As a possession/3rd down receiver, he's one of the better ones in the league.


That's a weak stat for an offense that's 31st in the entire NFL in points per game. When you have a guy that has only scored 2TDs in his last 37 games while currently 63rd in 1st down receptions this season, he obviously is a major contributor to that paltry performance. But "he is just doing his job." Laughing 63rd in the NFL in 1st down receptions on the 2nd to worst scoring offense in the NFL. BTW Damaris Johnson was leading Avant in 1st down receptions after starting the Cardinals game. Damaris hasn't received much playing time after starting that game...
Hey PE ... Not an Eagles fan, but I know that Avant is the 5th-6th opiton in the offense, the reason he is 63rd in 1st downs is because he only has 16 targets. Lol only 4 of the passes he has caught DIDNT go for first downs. Your hatred for Avant is silly. He is a decent player with good hands who is willing to get dirty ie block LBs go over the middle, and still catches 1st downs.


I don't know how much you know about football but you don't get targeted much WHEN YOU ARE RARELY OPEN AND POOR AT CREATING SEPARATION! There is nothing but a lack of talent that is prevention Avant from getting nmore targets in the 31st worst scoring offense in the NFL. You make it sound like other players are taking his opportunities away while he is wide open. Laughing Are Desean and Maclin amongst the top receivers this year while Avant is wide open?


So what is your logic here? That Jason Avant only gets open on 3rd downs and that is why he makes a majority of his catches on 3rd and long for clutch first downs? Why does he get so many 3rd down throws and convert on them if he can't get separation? The more likely scenario is that Vick is looking the way of Maclin/Jackson on early downs because they are his best bet after the catch of creating a big play. When it comes down to crunch time and they simply need to convert he often looks to Avant or Celek as the reliable guy that gets open and has sure hands.

It is so comical seeing you blow everything out of proportion and thinking that Jason Avant is the reason why the Eagles are 3-2. Laughing

I don't think anyone on the Eagles forum thinks Avant is a world-beater but he is a very reliable NFL receiver and someone many other teams would be happy to take on.
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johndeere1707 wrote:

Another Ginger QB in the AFC North.

Looking forward to the "No Soul Bowl" twice a year
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 9094
PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
TommyC376 wrote:
Like I said he is 5th - 6th option in your offense. Jackson, Maclin, Celek, McCoy and even the undrafted rookie D. Johnson will get looks over him. All I am saying is your mad for no reason, if your O sucks as bad as you say it does then look at the playmakers like Jackson, McCoy, Maclin and Celek. Not the slot WR who is asked to make 3rd down to 1st down catches.


Victor Cruz is a slot receiver and a playmaker, so is Percy Harvin. No one asks a slot receiver to never get open and be poor at YAC and scoring TDs. Laughing


again...avant is the 5th option at best. cruz is there second option and harvin is there first.
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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PowerElite


Joined: 25 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jason Avant has as many fumbles in his last 37 games as he has TDs. Jason Avant had more drops during the 2011 season as he has TDs his last 37 games.
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TommyC376


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

eagles101 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
TommyC376 wrote:
Like I said he is 5th - 6th option in your offense. Jackson, Maclin, Celek, McCoy and even the undrafted rookie D. Johnson will get looks over him. All I am saying is your mad for no reason, if your O sucks as bad as you say it does then look at the playmakers like Jackson, McCoy, Maclin and Celek. Not the slot WR who is asked to make 3rd down to 1st down catches.


Victor Cruz is a slot receiver and a playmaker, so is Percy Harvin. No one asks a slot receiver to never get open and be poor at YAC and scoring TDs. Laughing


again...avant is the 5th option at best. cruz is there second option and harvin is there first.
So basically PE believes that if Avant is the slot WR he should put up numbers like Welker, Cruz, and Harvin? ... Laughing
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Kiltman


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I said this in the thread he made two weeks ago

Quote:
In 2011 he only played 62% of snaps, 56% of which were run plays.


Combine that with his measily 80 targets (50 of which he caught, 3 he dropped, the others were on the QB). And you see that Avant does a good job with what is asked of him and fills his role nicely. Obviously it'd be great to have an All-Pro Slot guy..but they aren't that common. If you have somebody in mind I'd love to hear it PE.

I don't know...I think PE holds the depth chart in too high of a regard and doesn't realize the reality of how we use all of our receivers (that includes McCoy, Celek).
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