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Ed Reed vs Randy Moss: Who would you like to see get a ring?
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Who would you rather see get a ring (Regardless of what team you want to win)
Ed Reed
52%
 52%  [ 98 ]
Randy Moss
47%
 47%  [ 89 ]
Total Votes : 187

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BLick12


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BlaqOptic wrote:
BLick12 wrote:
BlaqOptic wrote:
BLick12 wrote:
BlaqOptic wrote:
iPwn wrote:
BlaqOptic wrote:
Please let us know the difference...
One is trying to make a play to help his team. The other is not trying to make a play to not help his team.


Yet one never gets called out for it while other safeties do... Randy Moss not running a route doesn't HURT his team. It just doesn't help. The other HURTS his team by going for the personal glory.

Look, I don't think that Reed severely hurts his team but I'm stretching no more than people calling Moss a "Me First" player due to not running routes on running plays. He's run LITERALLY MILLIONS of routes and you can point to a couple of 100 and that make him a "Me first" guy regardless? We can ignore his years in New England and San Fransisco?


So basically this all just comes down to your boy Troy getting bashed for busting coverage but not Reed?

Moss quit on Oakland. You can say he did all this other stuff, but that doesn't take away the fact he acted like a baby without his bottle and stopped trying. Not running routes HURTS a team, you are sadly mistaken if you think otherwise.


No it comes down to player double standards in general. It's something I've hated on this forum for forever....

Ed Reed routinely blows coverages but no one talks about it. Any other safety does it and there's a topic...

J-Jo blows a coverage and suddenly he sucks... A normal CB gets burned and nothing...

Joe Thomas gets beat for a sack on National TV and he's overrated. Another O-Lineman and nothing...

A lot of receivers have not run routes yet only Moss gets called out for it.

There's like a double standard for players and it just irks me bones. People seriously oversell this all the time.


Welcome to the internet, bro.


Well played..


Thanks.

But seriously, it runs rampant here but there are some of us that actually do watch the product on the field.

I pointed out that D-Jax dogged all his routes last year. Wasn't even like the Eagles were bad, he was just a punk about his contract. Someone in this thread mentioned other players not trying, they are paid $Millions to play a game, this isn't flag football. Even if I had a lousy team (much like the Eagles this year) and I saw someone giving a pisspoor effort (DRC I'm looking at you) I would call them out, losing isn't an excuse. Not running your routes, not making an effort to tackle a ball carrier hurts your team, don't get it twisted. It doesn't just "not help" it hurts if you have 10 guys trying and one guy playing like a bum, and it can spread like a cancer too.

Ed Reed has made his share of mistakes over his career but he has also made more than his fair share of plays. You take the good with the bad, but at least you don't have to question his effort.
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Another Ginger QB in the AFC North.

Looking forward to the "No Soul Bowl" twice a year
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theJ


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BLick12 wrote:
Thanks.

But seriously, it runs rampant here but there are some of us that actually do watch the product on the field.

I pointed out that D-Jax dogged all his routes last year. Wasn't even like the Eagles were bad, he was just a punk about his contract. Someone in this thread mentioned other players not trying, they are paid $Millions to play a game, this isn't flag football. Even if I had a lousy team (much like the Eagles this year) and I saw someone giving a pisspoor effort (DRC I'm looking at you) I would call them out, losing isn't an excuse. Not running your routes, not making an effort to tackle a ball carrier hurts your team, don't get it twisted. It doesn't just "not help" it hurts if you have 10 guys trying and one guy playing like a bum, and it can spread like a cancer too.

Ed Reed has made his share of mistakes over his career but he has also made more than his fair share of plays. You take the good with the bad, but at least you don't have to question his effort.

That was me. You missed the point. Every player takes plays off occassionally. It just happens more on losing teams, especially when they're down 30-0 in the 3rd quarter of a ball game.

It just so happens that Randy Moss admitted it, and so he's the poster child for a normal human reaction. Every player has taken plays off in his career. If you've played sports, you know the feeling. Maybe you didn't sprint back on a fast break in basketball because you started behind the play. Maybe you didn't get all the way down in your stance because you were tired. Maybe as a WR you didn't block particularly hard because the play was going to the other side.

Whatever the case, everyone has gone slow at least once. You either admit it, or you lie about it. Like i said, at least Randy isn't a liar.
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BLick12


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

theJ wrote:
BLick12 wrote:
Thanks.

But seriously, it runs rampant here but there are some of us that actually do watch the product on the field.

I pointed out that D-Jax dogged all his routes last year. Wasn't even like the Eagles were bad, he was just a punk about his contract. Someone in this thread mentioned other players not trying, they are paid $Millions to play a game, this isn't flag football. Even if I had a lousy team (much like the Eagles this year) and I saw someone giving a pisspoor effort (DRC I'm looking at you) I would call them out, losing isn't an excuse. Not running your routes, not making an effort to tackle a ball carrier hurts your team, don't get it twisted. It doesn't just "not help" it hurts if you have 10 guys trying and one guy playing like a bum, and it can spread like a cancer too.

Ed Reed has made his share of mistakes over his career but he has also made more than his fair share of plays. You take the good with the bad, but at least you don't have to question his effort.

That was me. You missed the point. Every player takes plays off occassionally. It just happens more on losing teams, especially when they're down 30-0 in the 3rd quarter of a ball game.

It just so happens that Randy Moss admitted it, and so he's the poster child for a normal human reaction. Every player has taken plays off in his career. If you've played sports, you know the feeling. Maybe you didn't sprint back on a fast break in basketball because you started behind the play. Maybe you didn't get all the way down in your stance because you were tired. Maybe as a WR you didn't block particularly hard because the play was going to the other side.

Whatever the case, everyone has gone slow at least once. You either admit it, or you lie about it. Like i said, at least Randy isn't a liar.


I'm aware. And obviously there is a line to be towed there. People don't acknowledge it if it has nothing to do with a play (a WR not blocking on the backside of a run play) and we can only base it on what we see, some WR routes you can't even see. But it was apparent to me and anyone that watched an Eagles game that Desean Jackson wasn't running his routes at full speed last year, he wasn't playing with any sense of purpose, DRC you can literally watch him make no effort to make a tackle. Randy Moss was a combination of that and himself admitting it as well. Perhaps he gets too much scrutiny for it, but it is what it is. He put himself in that situation. You're not always going to be on a winning team, I don't respect those that cry about it and give a poor effort.
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Another Ginger QB in the AFC North.

Looking forward to the "No Soul Bowl" twice a year
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to put this out there....

If Randy Moss "quits" on a route, and the ball is thrown to him and picked off, how exactly does that NOT hurt his team? I think it was Blaq who said that if Randy quits on a route it doesn't hurt his team, but if Ed blows a coverage, it does.

It goes both ways, really.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

theJ wrote:
BLick12 wrote:
Thanks.

But seriously, it runs rampant here but there are some of us that actually do watch the product on the field.

I pointed out that D-Jax dogged all his routes last year. Wasn't even like the Eagles were bad, he was just a punk about his contract. Someone in this thread mentioned other players not trying, they are paid $Millions to play a game, this isn't flag football. Even if I had a lousy team (much like the Eagles this year) and I saw someone giving a pisspoor effort (DRC I'm looking at you) I would call them out, losing isn't an excuse. Not running your routes, not making an effort to tackle a ball carrier hurts your team, don't get it twisted. It doesn't just "not help" it hurts if you have 10 guys trying and one guy playing like a bum, and it can spread like a cancer too.

Ed Reed has made his share of mistakes over his career but he has also made more than his fair share of plays. You take the good with the bad, but at least you don't have to question his effort.

That was me. You missed the point. Every player takes plays off occassionally. It just happens more on losing teams, especially when they're down 30-0 in the 3rd quarter of a ball game.

It just so happens that Randy Moss admitted it, and so he's the poster child for a normal human reaction. Every player has taken plays off in his career. If you've played sports, you know the feeling. Maybe you didn't sprint back on a fast break in basketball because you started behind the play. Maybe you didn't get all the way down in your stance because you were tired. Maybe as a WR you didn't block particularly hard because the play was going to the other side.

Whatever the case, everyone has gone slow at least once. You either admit it, or you lie about it. Like i said, at least Randy isn't a liar.

There's a HUGE difference between being physically drained to the point of exhaustion (not being able to get into your stance... not having the wind to run back on a fast break)... and simply quitting. In one, you have the energy and the ability to operate at 100%, but choose not to because 'there's no point' with the other you are operating at less than 100% and because of that, it affects your play. I'd agree that circumstance can allow the human mind to push past its 'limits' but let's not act like not pushing to those limits is the same as giving up. The two are different.

I've personally never taken a play off on the football field. Heck even when my school was outmatched and down by about 30 points. See the difference is, when you ARE down by that much and there's no hope of winning, you have to cancel everything else out... and make it about 'winning that play/ that possession/ that drive.', you have to set short term goal after short term goal. You have to have a short memory and just keep moving. If the other team has to put their backups in, that's embarrassing... insulting... I don't understand why suddenly I should want their backups to embarrass me out there. No, it's about playing for respect and dignity at that point. It's about not quitting. If you quit in those situations, cool, but let's not accuse every athlete of having quit.

Randy Moss indeed was a quitter. No reason a player of his prodigious talents should ever produce poorly enough to be had for a 4th round pick. Even on those poor teams, he could've at least had garbage stats that got him to 1000+ yards receiving or something. And it's not like he was forced to sign there either. He signed there and then quit. That's a sign of a man with low integrity.

I've always said that I'd always take Owens over Moss because at least with Owens, I'd never have to worry about him quitting on the field. With Moss, well... Randy plays when he feels like it....
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l3lind golfer


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Randy Moss not running routes is really overblown. ALL WRs do it if the running play is not toward their side, etc. Moss gets critized for it because he's such a polarizing figure and quite frankly, he's a very easy person to dislike. I've seen Ed Reed going half-assed on plays where it was almost a forgone conclusion a RB would be tackled so he doesn't hustle to get in on the tackle, etc. Everybody does that.

Moss and Reed come to play, neither guy is a lazy slacker. JaMarcus Russell is a lazy piece of crap who gives no effort; Moss and Reed are all-time greats at their position; you don't get there by giving a half-assed effort.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

l3lind golfer wrote:
Randy Moss not running routes is really overblown. ALL WRs do it if the running play is not toward their side, etc. Moss gets critized for it because he's such a polarizing figure and quite frankly, he's a very easy person to dislike. I've seen Ed Reed going half-assed on plays where it was almost a forgone conclusion a RB would be tackled so he doesn't hustle to get in on the tackle, etc. Everybody does that.

Moss and Reed come to play, neither guy is a lazy slacker. JaMarcus Russell is a lazy piece of crap who gives no effort; Moss and Reed are all-time greats at their position; you don't get there by giving a half-assed effort.

Yeah... but that's not the biggest point. I could care less if he doesn't give 100% effort on every route on every play, but to quit on games and a season is pretty intolerable.

And don't get me wrong, I used to love Moss before Oakland, even in the face of his 'personality'. But I've never been a fan of quitters. Moss can win a SB... and it wouldn't bother me, I like him as a player when he's playing... but to deprive a guy that I feel is the better option, I won't do.

No question that Moss got to where he is through some form of commitment and hard work, but at the same time, had he had the commitment of an Ed Reed, he'd already be considered the GOAT WR... and probably have a ring by now.
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Cerbs


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Definitely Ed Reed.

Randy Moss has always been an extremely arrogant player and not exactly one of the most humble individuals. As a Cowboys fan, I have every reason to be bitter about him considering we've NEVER beat any team he's played for, but his unpleasant personality is the main reason I dislike him. Always had mad respect for his natural ability, but he's not that same player anymore and really hasn't been a big deal to the Niners' offense this season. Seems like he only came back so he could catch a free ride to the Super Bowl playing on a good team. After 3 different teams got rid of him in 2010, I was shocked a good team actually picked him up.
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l3lind golfer


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's BS. Moss got traded to a hell hole in Oakland and he didn't wan to be there. He didn't go about it the classiest, but it is what it is. And you say he might have a ring now? How has his attitude prevented him from getting a ring? Two of his best chances where in 98 with the 15-1 Vikings and in 2007 with the 16-0 Patriots. He played his arse off.

Don't spew BS about him possibly having a ring if he gave 100% effort everytime or he didn't want to play for the Raiders. Moss gave 150% everytime he had a chance at a ring, so how could he have maybe won one? What more could he have done? He had historical seasons in both 98 and 07.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

l3lind golfer wrote:
That's BS. Moss got traded to a hell hole in Oakland and he didn't wan to be there. He didn't go about it the classiest, but it is what it is. And you say he might have a ring now? How has his attitude prevented him from getting a ring? Two of his best chances where in 98 with the 15-1 Vikings and in 2007 with the 16-0 Patriots. He played his arse off.

Don't spew BS about him possibly having a ring if he gave 100% effort everytime or he didn't want to play for the Raiders. Moss gave 150% everytime he had a chance at a ring, so how could he have maybe won one? What more could he have done? He had historical seasons in both 98 and 07.


The difference between Moss and all the 100s of players who quit on their teams every single year, as someone already pointed out, is Moss doesn't give a crap and speaks his mind. If he never said anything in Oakland odds are nobody even labels him.
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JaguarCrazy2832


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheVillain112 wrote:
I voted for Ed Reed. Hoping that he might retire if he wins... Laughing


Haha, I just dont want Moss to get one
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moss
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TheOsprey


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd rather see Ed Reed get a ring, but I don't want Ray Lewis getting another one. On top of that, I hate the Niners, so it's all a wash. I hope the game ends in an unbreakable 0-0 tie and no one can claim a championship. Laughing
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mossburg wrote:
l3lind golfer wrote:
That's BS. Moss got traded to a hell hole in Oakland and he didn't wan to be there. He didn't go about it the classiest, but it is what it is. And you say he might have a ring now? How has his attitude prevented him from getting a ring? Two of his best chances where in 98 with the 15-1 Vikings and in 2007 with the 16-0 Patriots. He played his arse off.

Don't spew BS about him possibly having a ring if he gave 100% effort everytime or he didn't want to play for the Raiders. Moss gave 150% everytime he had a chance at a ring, so how could he have maybe won one? What more could he have done? He had historical seasons in both 98 and 07.


The difference between Moss and all the 100s of players who quit on their teams every single year, as someone already pointed out, is Moss doesn't give a crap and speaks his mind. If he never said anything in Oakland odds are nobody even labels him.


this
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dtbrehm


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The amount of misconceptions on here regarding Moss is astonishing.
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