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| Who would you choose? |
| Lewis |
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36% |
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| Willis/Bowman |
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63% |
[ 77 ] |
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| Total Votes : 122 |
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CleBrowns07
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 4196
Location: Willoughby
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 Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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I must have read the question different than you guys but I thought the OP was asking if I'd rather take Lewis or either Bowman or Willis. In which case I'd take Lewis. But if Bowman/Willis means both then I'm going with the pair.
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l3lind golfer
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 29647
Location: California
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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Willis and Bowman are two top 5 MLB's right now, Lewis is the greatest of all-time at that position. And that is just on the field play. What about the leadership and intangables that Willis and Bowman couldn't dream of having. We're talking about quite possibly the greatest leader in the history of sports.
This isn't even close, it's Ray Lewis.
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reckless123
Joined: 02 Jun 2011
Posts: 5602
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| CleBrowns07 wrote: | | I must have read the question different than you guys but I thought the OP was asking if I'd rather take Lewis or either Bowman or Willis. In which case I'd take Lewis. But if Bowman/Willis means both then I'm going with the pair. |
Yeh its basically asking would you take Ray or Willis and Bowman. Quality or Quantity and Quality basically.
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reckless123
Joined: 02 Jun 2011
Posts: 5602
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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| CleBrowns07 wrote: | | I must have read the question different than you guys but I thought the OP was asking if I'd rather take Lewis or either Bowman or Willis. In which case I'd take Lewis. But if Bowman/Willis means both then I'm going with the pair. |
Yeh its basically asking would you take Ray or Willis and Bowman. Quality or Quantity and Quality basically.
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diamondbull424
Joined: 02 Dec 2007
Posts: 10033
Location: Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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I'm biased, but I'll take Ray Lewis... and here's why.
While clearly Willis/Bowman is better on paper, you have to consider that a) You'll have to pay both of them top dollar pretty soon and risk one leaving and b) Lewis WON'T be alone... the question simply fails to provide his wing mate. So if this is Lewis/Sharper vs Willis/Bowman... I'm taking the former. And basically any average LB next to Ray, he's made look much better than he turned out to be elsewhere (except Sharper, who was pretty good with the Texans IIRC). You could draft a young ILB to plug next to Prime Lewis if you wanted and have elite ILB play with at least 4 years together. You could also afford to spend the money it would take to retain Willis/Bowman... and go out and secure a pass rusher or IDL.
It's not like the question is asking, who wins a fight: Lewis or Willis/Bowman... this is a franchise. There are guaranteed to be other players surrounding Lewis that aren't being listed here.
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JaguarCrazy2832
Joined: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 73978
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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Damn thats tough, I think I'd take the 2 guys
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FourThreeMafia
Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 40604
Location: East of Sixburgh
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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| reckless123 wrote: | | CleBrowns07 wrote: | | I must have read the question different than you guys but I thought the OP was asking if I'd rather take Lewis or either Bowman or Willis. In which case I'd take Lewis. But if Bowman/Willis means both then I'm going with the pair. |
Yeh its basically asking would you take Ray or Willis and Bowman. Quality or Quantity and Quality basically. |
Way too simplified.
Two vastly different ranges of quality.
Sure. Willis and Bowman are great, but they arent even remotely close to Lewis in his prime.
I dont mind people choosing Willis and Bowman...cant go wrong with either...but Lewis in his prime was far more dangerous alone than those two are combined.
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l3lind golfer
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 29647
Location: California
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| FourThreeMafia wrote: | | I dont mind people choosing Willis and Bowman...cant go wrong with either...but Lewis in his prime was far more dangerous alone than those two are combined. |
Agreed. Anybody who actually watched Ray Lewis from 2000-2004 knows how much of a sheer beast he was. Like I said, you could either go with the Michael Jordan of the MLB position or you could take two other guys who are great all-star players. The choice is easily Jordan.
Ray Lewis is so great, I would just take my chances and draft another MLB or OLB to play beside him. Not to mention the astronomical leadership qualities he brings.
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neezy007
Joined: 21 May 2008
Posts: 8431
Location: El Paso
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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| l3lind golfer wrote: | Willis and Bowman are two top 5 MLB's right now, Lewis is the greatest of all-time at that position. And that is just on the field play. What about the leadership and intangables that Willis and Bowman couldn't dream of having. We're talking about quite possibly the greatest leader in the history of sports.
This isn't even close, it's Ray Lewis. |
Yeah. Sure. You don't know that. Ray yells and dances around. That doesn't make you a good leader. That's something else completely, stuff that goes on behind the scenes that you, or anyone else here, knows nothing about.
I know it happens with every team but I don't understand how a guy yelling at you will motivate someone to play harder. You are a grown up man playing a game for millions for dollars. You need some yelling, dancing, guy to scream at you for you to be motivated? Give me a break. If that's the case and people believe that's leadership that's sad.
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SnA ExclusiVe
Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 10675
Location: Spokane, WA
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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| neezy007 wrote: | | l3lind golfer wrote: | Willis and Bowman are two top 5 MLB's right now, Lewis is the greatest of all-time at that position. And that is just on the field play. What about the leadership and intangables that Willis and Bowman couldn't dream of having. We're talking about quite possibly the greatest leader in the history of sports.
This isn't even close, it's Ray Lewis. |
Yeah. Sure. You don't know that. Ray yells and dances around. That doesn't make you a good leader. That's something else completely, stuff that goes on behind the scenes that you, or anyone else here, knows nothing about.
I know it happens with every team but I don't understand how a guy yelling at you will motivate someone to play harder. You are a grown up man playing a game for millions for dollars. You need some yelling, dancing, guy to scream at you for you to be motivated? Give me a break. If that's the case and people believe that's leadership that's sad. |
Hm, so are you suggesting Ray Lewis is not a good leader then?
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ctp2124
Joined: 15 Jan 2011
Posts: 1248
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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| SnA ExclusiVe wrote: | | neezy007 wrote: | | l3lind golfer wrote: | Willis and Bowman are two top 5 MLB's right now, Lewis is the greatest of all-time at that position. And that is just on the field play. What about the leadership and intangables that Willis and Bowman couldn't dream of having. We're talking about quite possibly the greatest leader in the history of sports.
This isn't even close, it's Ray Lewis. |
Yeah. Sure. You don't know that. Ray yells and dances around. That doesn't make you a good leader. That's something else completely, stuff that goes on behind the scenes that you, or anyone else here, knows nothing about.
I know it happens with every team but I don't understand how a guy yelling at you will motivate someone to play harder. You are a grown up man playing a game for millions for dollars. You need some yelling, dancing, guy to scream at you for you to be motivated? Give me a break. If that's the case and people believe that's leadership that's sad. |
Hm, so are you suggesting Ray Lewis is not a good leader then? |
I don't think he's suggesting that, just questioning the media's perception of him. I heard an analyst say the other day the same thing as the bold part and thought, maybe but its all an assumption.
Obviously Ray is a great leader. That defense has had different coaches, players, etc. during the his tenure in Baltimore. Yet the defense was always one of the best. You can bet that in addition to his on the field play, that his leadership is a big reason for this.
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reckless123
Joined: 02 Jun 2011
Posts: 5602
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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| SnA ExclusiVe wrote: | | neezy007 wrote: | | l3lind golfer wrote: | Willis and Bowman are two top 5 MLB's right now, Lewis is the greatest of all-time at that position. And that is just on the field play. What about the leadership and intangables that Willis and Bowman couldn't dream of having. We're talking about quite possibly the greatest leader in the history of sports.
This isn't even close, it's Ray Lewis. |
Yeah. Sure. You don't know that. Ray yells and dances around. That doesn't make you a good leader. That's something else completely, stuff that goes on behind the scenes that you, or anyone else here, knows nothing about.
I know it happens with every team but I don't understand how a guy yelling at you will motivate someone to play harder. You are a grown up man playing a game for millions for dollars. You need some yelling, dancing, guy to scream at you for you to be motivated? Give me a break. If that's the case and people believe that's leadership that's sad. |
Hm, so are you suggesting Ray Lewis is not a good leader then? |
No he never said that. Even though i dont agree with what he is saying. He is saying that how do you actually tell who is a better leader, i.e what makes Ray Lewis a better leader than London Fletcher?
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SnA ExclusiVe
Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 10675
Location: Spokane, WA
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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| reckless123 wrote: | | SnA ExclusiVe wrote: | | neezy007 wrote: | | l3lind golfer wrote: | Willis and Bowman are two top 5 MLB's right now, Lewis is the greatest of all-time at that position. And that is just on the field play. What about the leadership and intangables that Willis and Bowman couldn't dream of having. We're talking about quite possibly the greatest leader in the history of sports.
This isn't even close, it's Ray Lewis. |
Yeah. Sure. You don't know that. Ray yells and dances around. That doesn't make you a good leader. That's something else completely, stuff that goes on behind the scenes that you, or anyone else here, knows nothing about.
I know it happens with every team but I don't understand how a guy yelling at you will motivate someone to play harder. You are a grown up man playing a game for millions for dollars. You need some yelling, dancing, guy to scream at you for you to be motivated? Give me a break. If that's the case and people believe that's leadership that's sad. |
Hm, so are you suggesting Ray Lewis is not a good leader then? |
No he never said that. Even though i dont agree with what he is saying. He is saying that how do you actually tell who is a better leader, i.e what makes Ray Lewis a better leader than London Fletcher? |
The fact that Ray elevates the play of everyone around him, and has done that for 16 years now, among several other factors. It's one thing to be the GOAT at your position, but when you've been here for 16 years, seen something like 10 coaches get hired from your defense, and you constantly make that unit stay in the top-10 and play at an elite level with a revolving door of players, that says a little bit about as a leader.
I really don't understand the questioning of his stature as a leader at this point in his career, lol, I'm a little blindsided by the question to be honest.
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| Leon Sandcastle wrote: | | Torrey Smith is a deep threat, he will never be a top-10 WR...he doesn't posses the raw athleticism that Dez does...sorry |
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RuskieTitan
Joined: 29 Apr 2007
Posts: 34375
Location: Front lines of Titania
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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Ray Lewis in his prime. No doubt about it.
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neezy007
Joined: 21 May 2008
Posts: 8431
Location: El Paso
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| SnA ExclusiVe wrote: | | reckless123 wrote: | | SnA ExclusiVe wrote: | | neezy007 wrote: | | l3lind golfer wrote: | Willis and Bowman are two top 5 MLB's right now, Lewis is the greatest of all-time at that position. And that is just on the field play. What about the leadership and intangables that Willis and Bowman couldn't dream of having. We're talking about quite possibly the greatest leader in the history of sports.
This isn't even close, it's Ray Lewis. |
Yeah. Sure. You don't know that. Ray yells and dances around. That doesn't make you a good leader. That's something else completely, stuff that goes on behind the scenes that you, or anyone else here, knows nothing about.
I know it happens with every team but I don't understand how a guy yelling at you will motivate someone to play harder. You are a grown up man playing a game for millions for dollars. You need some yelling, dancing, guy to scream at you for you to be motivated? Give me a break. If that's the case and people believe that's leadership that's sad. |
Hm, so are you suggesting Ray Lewis is not a good leader then? |
No he never said that. Even though i dont agree with what he is saying. He is saying that how do you actually tell who is a better leader, i.e what makes Ray Lewis a better leader than London Fletcher? |
The fact that Ray elevates the play of everyone around him, and has done that for 16 years now, among several other factors. It's one thing to be the GOAT at your position, but when you've been here for 16 years, seen something like 10 coaches get hired from your defense, and you constantly make that unit stay in the top-10 and play at an elite level with a revolving door of players, that says a little bit about as a leader.
I really don't understand the questioning of his stature as a leader at this point in his career, lol, I'm a little blindsided by the question to be honest. |
I actually typed something up but I deleted it. I think Ray is a good leader but because of the work he puts in, how hard he tries, and how he plays. That I will not question. The yelling and stuff ehhh. He does elevate the play of those around him because of his work and preparation.
I just think someone saying he might be the best leader in the history of sports is insane. Great leader, no doubt. But what separates him from a Willis, Fletcher, or any other player deemed a great leader? He may be a better player but that's different. To me I see it as all the other stuff he does as being the deciding factor. Ray yells and dances and people talk about his incredible leadership. It's like all that stuff is the deciding factor.
I realize I may not have been clear. But I hope that clears it up.
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That's how I feel too <3 |
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