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whodatworm23
Joined: 23 Dec 2006
Posts: 4658
Location: Nawlins
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 Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:54 am Post subject: Saints fan here... Need you guys help |
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Hey guys,
Sorry to bother you on your fourm but alot of Saints fans are looking for an answer that maybe you guys can give. By now I'm sure you may have heard the news that Sean Payton has fired Steve Spagnuolo and has commited to switching our defensive scheme to the 3-4.
Our question is this...
Brodrick Bunkley whom we signed from you guys last season. Do you guys feel he's a good fit as a 34 NT dispite his less than ideal size for the position?
When he was in Denver diden't you guys run a little 34 as well? If so, how did he do?
Thanks for all the help guys
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jonnyj20
Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Posts: 10766
Location: SLC
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 1:22 am Post subject: |
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He only played here in 2011 under Dennis Allen in the 4-3. Not sure if he is a 2 gap DT or not.
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BroncoinGermany
Joined: 09 Mar 2012
Posts: 3251
Location: DE
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 2:45 am Post subject: |
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Do you guys want Elvis for a 2nd? Career highs in a 3-4 at OLB, won't ever repeat that under Fox, and the Saints need pass-rushers.
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sebber
Joined: 10 Feb 2010
Posts: 29
Location: Denmark
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 6:43 am Post subject: |
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| BroncoinGermany wrote: | | Do you guys want Elvis for a 2nd? Career highs in a 3-4 at OLB, won't ever repeat that under Fox, and the Saints need pass-rushers. |
Agree. Elvis needs to go to a 3-4 defense again. He's not worth the money on a 4-3 defense.
As for Bunkley being a 34 NT. Not in my opinion. At least not a top class one. He fits a 4-3 defense better
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| jsthomp2007 wrote: | | Tebow can run and avoid some sacks, where Orton seems to urinate on himself at the sight of a pass rush. |
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lomaxgr
Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 21535
Location: Manchester, England
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 9:20 am Post subject: |
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People make too much of the difference between a 3-4 and a 4-3, especially with a one dimensional 3-4 OLB like Elvis. He was too stiff and unathletic to do anything but rush the passer as a 3-4 OLB, so he doesn't offer the elite skillset (dropping into short zones etc) that a quality 3-4 OLB does.
Elvis rushes the passer from a two point stance plenty as a 4-3 DE and from a similiar position from a gap perspective too, so there really isn't much difference between how he plays now and how he played as a 3-4 OLB. If anything, we are less predictable now because we can use one of our 3 LB's (in our base 4-3) in different ways that Elvis wasn't able to (if we are going off the premise that 4 men are rushing the passer).
As for the question - Bunkley plays too high too often to be a 3-4 NT in my opinion. Plus, having issues with your knee(s) is never good as a 3-4 NT.
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jsthomp2007
Joined: 11 Jan 2008
Posts: 8351
Location: USA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 9:22 am Post subject: |
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He is very good in a hot dog eating contest.
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JerseysFinest27
Joined: 07 Jan 2010
Posts: 8833
Location: New Jersey... Props to Joe_Is_The_Best on the sig
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 11:36 am Post subject: |
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| lomaxgr wrote: | People make too much of the difference between a 3-4 and a 4-3, especially with a one dimensional 3-4 OLB like Elvis. He was too stiff and unathletic to do anything but rush the passer as a 3-4 OLB, so he doesn't offer the elite skillset (dropping into short zones etc) that a quality 3-4 OLB does.
Elvis rushes the passer from a two point stance plenty as a 4-3 DE and from a similiar position from a gap perspective too, so there really isn't much difference between how he plays now and how he played as a 3-4 OLB. If anything, we are less predictable now because we can use one of our 3 LB's (in our base 4-3) in different ways that Elvis wasn't able to (if we are going off the premise that 4 men are rushing the passer).
As for the question - Bunkley plays too high too often to be a 3-4 NT in my opinion. Plus, having issues with your knee(s) is never good as a 3-4 NT. |
Agree with everything said here. Well said lomaxgr.
Bunkley is not a 34 NT nor should he be in consideration for it. Id consider Akiem Hicks before Bunkley. That said, I think a 34 defense is a bad idea for the team they have. Can Will Smith and Cam Jordan be OLB's? Maybe, but I wouldnt do it. I think David Hawthorne and Curtis Lofton are nice 34 ILBs and Marques Wilson would benefit moving to OLB than strictly DE.
I think the biggest flaw to this defense was its pass rushing. They had no consistent pass rush. Whether that was Spags fault or not, Im not sure.
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hibdib31
Joined: 22 Aug 2011
Posts: 2128
Location: NoVA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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| JerseysFinest27 wrote: | | lomaxgr wrote: | People make too much of the difference between a 3-4 and a 4-3, especially with a one dimensional 3-4 OLB like Elvis. He was too stiff and unathletic to do anything but rush the passer as a 3-4 OLB, so he doesn't offer the elite skillset (dropping into short zones etc) that a quality 3-4 OLB does.
Elvis rushes the passer from a two point stance plenty as a 4-3 DE and from a similiar position from a gap perspective too, so there really isn't much difference between how he plays now and how he played as a 3-4 OLB. If anything, we are less predictable now because we can use one of our 3 LB's (in our base 4-3) in different ways that Elvis wasn't able to (if we are going off the premise that 4 men are rushing the passer).
As for the question - Bunkley plays too high too often to be a 3-4 NT in my opinion. Plus, having issues with your knee(s) is never good as a 3-4 NT. |
Agree with everything said here. Well said lomaxgr.
Bunkley is not a 34 NT nor should he be in consideration for it. Id consider Akiem Hicks before Bunkley. That said, I think a 34 defense is a bad idea for the team they have. Can Will Smith and Cam Jordan be OLB's? Maybe, but I wouldnt do it. I think David Hawthorne and Curtis Lofton are nice 34 ILBs and Marques Wilson would benefit moving to OLB than strictly DE.
I think the biggest flaw to this defense was its pass rushing. They had no consistent pass rush. Whether that was Spags fault or not, Im not sure. |
Wasn't Cam Jordan a 34 DE in college (at Cal)? I think you're right about the linebackers: Wilson at OLB, Lofton & Hawthorne at ILB.
All in all, no, I wouldn't expect much from Bunkley as an 34 NT. |
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AntiSuperstar
Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 4444
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 1:06 pm Post subject: |
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Bunkley could play Nose Tackle maybe, but he looked pretty terrible this year with the Saints from what I saw so I'm not sure one can expect much from him.
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Donut
Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Posts: 13057
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| Posted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| JerseysFinest27 wrote: | | lomaxgr wrote: | People make too much of the difference between a 3-4 and a 4-3, especially with a one dimensional 3-4 OLB like Elvis. He was too stiff and unathletic to do anything but rush the passer as a 3-4 OLB, so he doesn't offer the elite skillset (dropping into short zones etc) that a quality 3-4 OLB does.
Elvis rushes the passer from a two point stance plenty as a 4-3 DE and from a similiar position from a gap perspective too, so there really isn't much difference between how he plays now and how he played as a 3-4 OLB. If anything, we are less predictable now because we can use one of our 3 LB's (in our base 4-3) in different ways that Elvis wasn't able to (if we are going off the premise that 4 men are rushing the passer).
As for the question - Bunkley plays too high too often to be a 3-4 NT in my opinion. Plus, having issues with your knee(s) is never good as a 3-4 NT. |
Agree with everything said here. Well said lomaxgr.
Bunkley is not a 34 NT nor should he be in consideration for it. Id consider Akiem Hicks before Bunkley. That said, I think a 34 defense is a bad idea for the team they have. Can Will Smith and Cam Jordan be OLB's? Maybe, but I wouldnt do it. I think David Hawthorne and Curtis Lofton are nice 34 ILBs and Marques Wilson would benefit moving to OLB than strictly DE.
I think the biggest flaw to this defense was its pass rushing. They had no consistent pass rush. Whether that was Spags fault or not, Im not sure. |
Cam Jordan should be the 5 tech in the 3-4. He should be closer to 300lbs than he was when he was drafted. I dont think Jordan is athletic enough to be the elephant OLB unless he slimmed way down.
| BroncoinGermany wrote: | | Do you guys want Elvis for a 2nd? Career highs in a 3-4 at OLB, won't ever repeat that under Fox, and the Saints need pass-rushers. |
W/ his contract you'd be lucky to get a 5th let alone a 2nd. He wouldnt be a top oLB even if moved back. His ability to play the run in a 3-4 vs 4-3 might be a bit better but he wouldnt be complete player there.
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