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Randy Moss...Just 2 full years with a HOF QB...Brady
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Django


Joined: 03 May 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 12:41 pm    Post subject: Randy Moss...Just 2 full years with a HOF QB...Brady Reply with quote

With Brady..His averages

90.5 catches 1378 yards 18 TDs

In 2008 he had Matt Cassel throwing to him.

In Oakland he had a done Aaron Brooks, Andrew Walter, Kerry Collins.

In Minnesota he had a end of the career Cunningham (that hurts to say..but the way he dropped off the next year...means it was more Moss than RC in 9Cool, Jeff George Laughing , Culpepper (Again...was just soooo inconsistent. Good one year, bad the next year, etc etc)

Obviously 2010 hurts his legacy. I give him a pass for quitting on the Bed and Breakfast offense.

He had partial seasons with HOF QBs in Brett Favre and Brady. Again...that was just 4 games with Brady in 2010 (However, his full seasons were epic) and just 4 games with a done Brett Favre.

A lot of people rip on Moss...and yes he deserves it. He never had the heart and head of Rice...but...he was so talented that if he played with HOF QB's the majority of his career like Rice did.......

He'd pass him in statistics and it would be much tougher to say Rice is better.
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wwhickok


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For me, I just view Rice as the greatest WR ever, but a lot of that is stat based.

Moss makes a valid point about impact. Moss, in almost every situation he has been in, has made a major impact, and he has had pretty darn good stats as well. Rice also had 6 extra seasons, I don't see Moss playing as long as Rice did.

Furthermore, at any position, it should be your goal to be the 'greatest ever' and furthermore, you should have a lot of confidence in yourself. Some will interpret this as ego, some will see it for what it really is. A WR, who has been to the Super Bowl before, believing in himself, knowing what he is capable of, and hoping that he can back it up with a ring.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My only contention is that a lot of the "loss" that Moss had suffered in QB play was due to his own doing. Had he kept his mouth shut and just played ball, he'd still be with New England.

Nobody is denying the impact and the pure physical skill that Moss had - in that, he simply had no equal. It's the muscles between the ears that was his undoing, even if it DID get him off of a sinking Vikings ship at the time, as well as a sunk Raiders ship. He had a perfect opportunity to stay in NE and build on his resume, but he screwed that up.
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incognito_man


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most wrs don't get any full years with a hof qb.
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x0x


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love how someone could put down Culpepper, Cunningham and George to raise Randy Moss' status.

Cry me a freaking river.

Cunningham and Culpepper were League MVP candidates, Culpepper in 2000 and 2004 had Peyton not gone on a tear.

Then Cunningham is a Hall of Fame QB who had his best passing season in 98, past his prime mind you.



As for George, say whatever the hell you want, he was in no way a detriment to his receivers. A detriment to his teams? Yes, but not his receivers.

In 98, George was a more mature player and he still had the shotgun arm that most receivers would love their QB to have.


Cassell was Cassell. I believe the guy did make a Pro Bowl.


And Kerry Collins was a solid QB most of his career, if inconsistent.


Moss had arguably arguably one year without a QB, his 2nd season with the Raiders where he played half-assed anyway.


The man had Favre, for whatever that's worth and this season working with Smith and Kapper.


He's effectively done as a WR threat at age 35 and had already declined significantly by age 33. He couldn't sniff Sterling Sharpe's jock.


Massively overrated player.
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Bodhi


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jerry Rice's stats didn't drop off at all when he played with backup QBs. For the most part, they actually got better.
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reckless123


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

people have a tendency to believe that Moss played with some terrible QBs. He played with some very good QBs. While people act like Jerry was nothing without a HOF QB.
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Worm Guts


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
He's effectively done as a WR threat at age 35 and had already declined significantly by age 33. He couldn't sniff Sterling Sharpe's jock.


Lol. No doubt he declined by the time he was 33, but that doesn't make overrated. The idea that Sharpe was better is ridiculous and baseless.
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mitchconnor


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's widely(and correctly) accepted that no one besides Hutson and Rice is seriously in the discussion for greatest WR.

And Moss was blessed with good to great qbs for most of his career.
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mitchconnor


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

x0x wrote:



He's effectively done as a WR threat at age 35 and had already declined significantly by age 33. He couldn't sniff Sterling Sharpe's jock.



Sharpe is the most underrated wr of recent years, imo, but this is overstating things.
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x0x


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Worm Guts wrote:
Quote:
He's effectively done as a WR threat at age 35 and had already declined significantly by age 33. He couldn't sniff Sterling Sharpe's jock.


Lol. No doubt he declined by the time he was 33, but that doesn't make overrated. The idea that Sharpe was better is ridiculous and baseless.



Settle down child.

Sterling was a freak and it's too bad his career ended so early. Would have been a great playoff receiver as well as GOAT, definitively.

From what I saw, he was physically the best up there with Rice. Calvin and Fitz are in that window too.



Moss a fantastic physical receiver? Absolutely. But his work ethic and plain idiocy should be counted against him as well.
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x0x


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mitchconnor wrote:
x0x wrote:



He's effectively done as a WR threat at age 35 and had already declined significantly by age 33. He couldn't sniff Sterling Sharpe's jock.



Sharpe is the most underrated wr of recent years, imo, but this is overstating things.



The gap is not tremendous but I'd take Sterling over Moss any day.


One big issue that gets overlooked is Moss had offensive support. He had Cris Carter and Wes Welker taking their own coverage.

Oh hell, Minnesota's passing game had so many weapons it was impossible to put too much coverage on Moss without getting pounded.



Sterling was definitively THE receiving weapon on those Packer teams. He had good QB play but he was undeniably the focal point of his team's passing attack. Compare his numbers to the rest of the team for reference.

He did catch passes from Anthony Dilweg at one point too, to add to that point.
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dante9876


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If somebody said take this guy for one game in their prime Moss vs Rice. That decision is much harder than people make it out to be. Another that trips me out is Rice played 20 years and he never gets the compile stats over time argument. I think Rice is great but his stats are far and above everyone else is cause his time and cause he played with HOF's QBs for the majority of his career.
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x0x


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dante9876 wrote:
If somebody said take this guy for one game in their prime Moss vs Rice.


In the Super Bowl you take Rice unless you want to gamble.

Moss was not the playoff performer Rice was. Although he wasn't terrible.



But give me any WR in the history of the NFL? Sterling Sharpe or Larry Fitzgerald.
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Worm Guts


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

x0x wrote:
He did catch passes from Anthony Dilweg at one point too, to add to that point.


And he ended up with 67 catches and 6 TD's that season

Quote:
One big issue that gets overlooked is Moss had offensive support. He had Cris Carter and Wes Welker taking their own coverage.

Oh hell, Minnesota's passing game had so many weapons it was impossible to put too much coverage on Moss without getting pounded.


Moss's best statistical year for the Vikings was 2003. The Vikings leading rusher that year was Moe Williams, their 2nd leading receiver was also Moe Williams.
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