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JDBrocks
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
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 Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 9:33 am Post subject: |
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| SaveourSonics wrote: | | Here's the reason I don't like deals like this. You're essentially paying the player for what they have already done and not for what you expect them to do. Jennings is worth no where near that type of money for the type of production realistic onlookers should expect. The Vikings are pretty much paying him for what he did with the Packers and not necessarily for what they expect he'll do for them. |
I wholeheartedly disagree with this. Pure conjecture on your part.
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vike daddy
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 66621
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| JDBrocks wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | Here's the reason I don't like deals like this. You're essentially paying the player for what they have already done and not for what you expect them to do. Jennings is worth no where near that type of money for the type of production realistic onlookers should expect. The Vikings are pretty much paying him for what he did with the Packers and not necessarily for what they expect he'll do for them. |
I wholeheartedly disagree with this. Pure conjecture on your part. |
nor does it make any sense, given what some Seattle fans have said about Harvin's pay vs his expectations. at least one of them hopes he'll get 1000 yards and 10 tds. that's pretty close to what he did for the Vikings, yet we paid him $2,000,000 a season while Seattle would be paying him $10,000,000 for the same.
another example would be Sidney Rice. I don't remember what he's paid right now but he only had 750 yards or so of production last year. he obviously was hired and is being paid based on what he did previously for another team, and mainly in 2009.
i'm not in any way comparing Harvin to Jennings because they are different players having different roles on their teams now, but i am comparing the statement of what they're paid vs what they are expected to produce.
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GBPackers79
Joined: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 19239
Location: New Jersey
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:43 am Post subject: |
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| vike daddy wrote: | | JDBrocks wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | Here's the reason I don't like deals like this. You're essentially paying the player for what they have already done and not for what you expect them to do. Jennings is worth no where near that type of money for the type of production realistic onlookers should expect. The Vikings are pretty much paying him for what he did with the Packers and not necessarily for what they expect he'll do for them. |
I wholeheartedly disagree with this. Pure conjecture on your part. |
nor does it make any sense, given what some Seattle fans have said about Harvin's pay vs his expectations. at least one of them hopes he'll get 1000 yards and 10 tds. that's pretty close to what he did for the Vikings, yet we paid him $2,000,000 a season while Seattle would be paying him $10,000,000 for the same.
another example would be Sidney Rice. I don't remember what he's paid right now but he only had 750 yards or so of production last year. he obviously was hired and is being paid based on what he did previously for another team, and mainly in 2009.
i'm not in any way comparing Harvin to Jennings because they are different players having different roles on their teams now, but i am comparing the statement of what they're paid vs what they are expected to produce. |
Wasn't Harvin on his rookie contract for you? Seattle extended him because they had to if they wanted to keep him, so I don't understand that point at all. If the Vikes wanted to keep him, they would have been paying him more than $2 million.
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packerbacker87 on the sig | Arodsmightybelt wrote: | | Sam Barrington, whose dat? he a championship? |
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GBPackers79
Joined: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 19239
Location: New Jersey
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:55 am Post subject: |
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| Uncle Buck wrote: | | DavidatMIZZOU wrote: | | Kempes wrote: | | Can I get a "ooooooooh controversial"? |
No, but you can get a typical Vikings.
Typical Vikings. |
We could also give you a "Typical Ted". Too cheap to pay his good players so he lets them slip away to the competition. Apparently good old Ted "Ebeniezer" Thompson wasn't willing to open the checkbook to sign a running back like Steven Jackson either. Typical... |
LOL, you can't be serious?
Jordy Nelson, TJ Lang, Tim Masthay, Josh Sitton, Charles Woodson, these guys didn't get paid? Who are you referring to, Cullen Jenkins? Greg Jennings is a good player but as he ages his game is going to work much better in the slot and we have Cobb there. There's no way it would've been worth it for GB to pay what MIN did. Or you can just spew some nonsense about how TT is cheap if that makes you happy.
I better get ready for Rodgers, Raji, and Matthews to walk then, huh?
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packerbacker87 on the sig | Arodsmightybelt wrote: | | Sam Barrington, whose dat? he a championship? |
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vike daddy
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 66621
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:59 am Post subject: |
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| GBPackers79 wrote: | | Wasn't Harvin on his rookie contract for you? Seattle extended him because they had to if they wanted to keep him, so I don't understand that point at all. If the Vikes wanted to keep him, they would have been paying him more than $2 million. |
sure, but the point still remains that the Seattle fan(s) who expect/hope he'll produce 1000 yards and 10 tds isn't asking for much, relative to his $10,000,000 contract. same goes for Rice, albeit for less cash.
and that was SoS' point - that supposedly the Vikings hired and are paying Jennings based on his previous output, and overpaid him for it.
wouldn't Seattle be doing the same thing? particularly with Rice.
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CriminalMind
Joined: 25 Aug 2011
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Location: Toronto, CA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:19 am Post subject: |
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I think Harvin offensive impact will be more then just his numbers, 10/1000.
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GBPackers79
Joined: 20 Jan 2007
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Location: New Jersey
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:29 am Post subject: |
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| vike daddy wrote: | | GBPackers79 wrote: | | Wasn't Harvin on his rookie contract for you? Seattle extended him because they had to if they wanted to keep him, so I don't understand that point at all. If the Vikes wanted to keep him, they would have been paying him more than $2 million. |
sure, but the point still remains that the Seattle fan(s) who expect/hope he'll produce 1000 yards and 10 tds isn't asking for much, relative to his $10,000,000 contract. same goes for Rice, albeit for less cash.
and that was SoS' point - that supposedly the Vikings hired and are paying Jennings based on his previous output, and overpaid him for it.
wouldn't Seattle be doing the same thing? particularly with Rice. |
You're also referring to what a fan said and matching that up with what the organization paid Harvin.
Harvin in 2011 at what, 23 years old? 87 catches, 967 yards, 6 TDs, 1 kickoff return TD, 2 rushing TDs. He's a dynamic player that is only going to improve on those numbers if he's healthy, it isn't only about his receiving numbers. I absolutely think he got paid for what they anticipate him to do.
I understand the point, and you're right because players do earn their contracts with their play. But look at a guy like Steven Jackson, his previous output had no impact on what he got on the open market. Jennings is turning 30 at the beginning of this upcoming season and he hasn't played 16 games since 2010, I would imagine that's what SOS is basing his post off of. Realistically, how long do you expect him to play at the level he was at in 2010?
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packerbacker87 on the sig | Arodsmightybelt wrote: | | Sam Barrington, whose dat? he a championship? |
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 39492
Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| CriminalMind wrote: | | I think Harvin offensive impact will be more then just his numbers, 10/1000. |
Sure as a kick returner.
He isnt really a player defensive coordinators have to be overly concerned about though, given his limitations as a receiver. Crowd the LOS, which teams already do for Lynch, take good angles and tackle is the extent to game planning against Harvin. Sure in the past teams game planned for stopping all the gimmick stuff they ran with Harvin out of the backfield, but I highly doubt the Seahawks will be exposing there $67M man to carries/gimmicks in the backfield. That would seem foolish and a quick way to put Percy on IR. Harvin's ankle injury came off a running play IIRC.
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 39492
Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:57 am Post subject: |
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| GBPackers79 wrote: | | vike daddy wrote: | | GBPackers79 wrote: | | Wasn't Harvin on his rookie contract for you? Seattle extended him because they had to if they wanted to keep him, so I don't understand that point at all. If the Vikes wanted to keep him, they would have been paying him more than $2 million. |
sure, but the point still remains that the Seattle fan(s) who expect/hope he'll produce 1000 yards and 10 tds isn't asking for much, relative to his $10,000,000 contract. same goes for Rice, albeit for less cash.
and that was SoS' point - that supposedly the Vikings hired and are paying Jennings based on his previous output, and overpaid him for it.
wouldn't Seattle be doing the same thing? particularly with Rice. |
You're also referring to what a fan said and matching that up with what the organization paid Harvin.
Harvin in 2011 at what, 23 years old? 87 catches, 967 yards, 6 TDs, 1 kickoff return TD, 2 rushing TDs. He's a dynamic player that is only going to improve on those numbers if he's healthy, it isn't only about his receiving numbers. I absolutely think he got paid for what they anticipate him to do.
I understand the point, and you're right because players do earn their contracts with their play. But look at a guy like Steven Jackson, his previous output had no impact on what he got on the open market. Jennings is turning 30 at the beginning of this upcoming season and he hasn't played 16 games since 2010, I would imagine that's what SOS is basing his post off of. Realistically, how long do you expect him to play at the level he was at in 2010? |
Harvin was dynamic and versatile on a rookie contract. The question Seattle faces is how much contact do you expose Percy too. He hasnt missed a lot of playing time, but he has always been player to miss practice time with injuries and has frequently played through injuries throughout his career.
If you're Seattle, do you even want to expose Harvin to carrying the football, especially out of the back field. His frame is clearly not capable of handling the carries.
Looking beyond games played, Harvin has battled with injuries constantly throughout his career. I think this is partly because of the role MN has used him in and I dont think Seattle will do the same. Therefore, all this extra dynamic stuff where is he gets the ball all over the formation probably wont be very relevant for Seattle.
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Kampman74
Joined: 30 Apr 2007
Posts: 5574
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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Good signing for the Vikes. Pack just could not afford him to keep him. A couple big contracts coming up that are going to break the bank. Also pretty much our most stacked position, so it just wouldn't make sense.
Thankfully its Ponder passing him the ball, so this won't be Jennings 07-11, but that should still free up a defender from in the box against Peterson.
He is a pretty good blocker too, nothing great, but also not bad at it, so that only helps in the run game. |
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Sacks98
Joined: 21 Dec 2009
Posts: 3502
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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| vike daddy wrote: | | GBPackers79 wrote: | | Wasn't Harvin on his rookie contract for you? Seattle extended him because they had to if they wanted to keep him, so I don't understand that point at all. If the Vikes wanted to keep him, they would have been paying him more than $2 million. |
sure, but the point still remains that the Seattle fan(s) who expect/hope he'll produce 1000 yards and 10 tds isn't asking for much, relative to his $10,000,000 contract. same goes for Rice, albeit for less cash.
and that was SoS' point - that supposedly the Vikings hired and are paying Jennings based on his previous output, and overpaid him for it.
wouldn't Seattle be doing the same thing? particularly with Rice. |
Rice had Whitehurst and Jackson throwing him the ball in his first year i think he will be much better now that Wilson is the QB.
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sp6488
Joined: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 6230
Location: MD
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| GBPackers79 wrote: | | Uncle Buck wrote: | | DavidatMIZZOU wrote: | | Kempes wrote: | | Can I get a "ooooooooh controversial"? |
No, but you can get a typical Vikings.
Typical Vikings. |
We could also give you a "Typical Ted". Too cheap to pay his good players so he lets them slip away to the competition. Apparently good old Ted "Ebeniezer" Thompson wasn't willing to open the checkbook to sign a running back like Steven Jackson either. Typical... |
LOL, you can't be serious?
Jordy Nelson, TJ Lang, Tim Masthay, Josh Sitton, Charles Woodson, these guys didn't get paid? Who are you referring to, Cullen Jenkins? Greg Jennings is a good player but as he ages his game is going to work much better in the slot and we have Cobb there. There's no way it would've been worth it for GB to pay what MIN did. Or you can just spew some nonsense about how TT is cheap if that makes you happy.
I better get ready for Rodgers, Raji, and Matthews to walk then, huh? |
Lol. I'm with you man. Symptom of being a good team is having to let guys, especially non-core non-lt guys move on for bigger paydays. There's actually been a minority of Baltimore fans calling the radio stations out here calling Steve biscotti cheap, lol.
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Atari-XXX
Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 1140
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Uncle Buck wrote: | | DavidatMIZZOU wrote: | | Kempes wrote: | | Can I get a "ooooooooh controversial"? |
No, but you can get a typical Vikings.
Typical Vikings. |
We could also give you a "Typical Ted". Too cheap to pay his good players so he lets them slip away to the competition. Apparently good old Ted "Ebeniezer" Thompson wasn't willing to open the checkbook to sign a running back like Steven Jackson either. Typical... |
How many SB rings have all those FA signings and trades gotten the Vikings over the last 5-10 years? Jared Allen, Favre, Berrian, Sharper.
But hey, take a good look at Jennings' SB ring. It's the closest at seeing a SB ring that most Vikings players will ever get to.  |
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HighHopes
Joined: 01 Jun 2008
Posts: 25304
Location: Courtroom
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Atari-XXX wrote: | | Uncle Buck wrote: | | DavidatMIZZOU wrote: | | Kempes wrote: | | Can I get a "ooooooooh controversial"? |
No, but you can get a typical Vikings.
Typical Vikings. |
We could also give you a "Typical Ted". Too cheap to pay his good players so he lets them slip away to the competition. Apparently good old Ted "Ebeniezer" Thompson wasn't willing to open the checkbook to sign a running back like Steven Jackson either. Typical... |
How many SB rings have all those FA signings and trades gotten the Vikings over the last 5-10 years? Jared Allen, Favre, Berrian, Sharper.
But hey, take a good look at Jennings' SB ring. It's the closest at seeing a SB ring that most Vikings players will ever get to. |
This thread has really gone on too long.....
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Vikefan79
Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 25102
Location: Atlanta
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| Posted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Atari-XXX wrote: | | Uncle Buck wrote: | | DavidatMIZZOU wrote: | | Kempes wrote: | | Can I get a "ooooooooh controversial"? |
No, but you can get a typical Vikings.
Typical Vikings. |
We could also give you a "Typical Ted". Too cheap to pay his good players so he lets them slip away to the competition. Apparently good old Ted "Ebeniezer" Thompson wasn't willing to open the checkbook to sign a running back like Steven Jackson either. Typical... |
How many SB rings have all those FA signings and trades gotten the Vikings over the last 5-10 years? Jared Allen, Favre, Berrian, Sharper.
But hey, take a good look at Jennings' SB ring. It's the closest at seeing a SB ring that most Vikings players will ever get to. |
Packer fan brought out the Super Bowl ring argument.
/thread
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