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Seahawks could face fines from NFL due to PED suspensions
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Jakuvious


Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Posts: 9162
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
Cali2Wisco wrote:
imani wrote:
Persian Bolt wrote:
Take a draft pick away, that'll wake the team up.


The majority of these players were camp fodder, bench players at best. Not sure how that solves the problem for guys trying to make a roster.


Sherman and Irvin are camp fodder?


1. Sherman was never caught officially

2. Even if you count them both, that's 2, out of 6 players caught. Making them the minority and the camp fodder the majority. It believe it may be basic math, but i'm not certain.


And you're just conveniently choosing to omit Brandon Browner? Or is he camp fodder? Laughing
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hawksman81


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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jakuvious wrote:
imani wrote:
Cali2Wisco wrote:
imani wrote:
Persian Bolt wrote:
Take a draft pick away, that'll wake the team up.


The majority of these players were camp fodder, bench players at best. Not sure how that solves the problem for guys trying to make a roster.


Sherman and Irvin are camp fodder?


1. Sherman was never caught officially

2. Even if you count them both, that's 2, out of 6 players caught. Making them the minority and the camp fodder the majority. It believe it may be basic math, but i'm not certain.


And you're just conveniently choosing to omit Brandon Browner? Or is he camp fodder? Laughing


And John Moffitt. Embarassed
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BangBang


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They deserve it... they keep cheating. Make an example out of 'em.
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NINERFAN_4_LIFE


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently they had a "players only" meeting about these suspensions. I would have loved to be a fly on the wall with a video camera... where the hell is bill belichick when you need him??

I could picture it going something like this

Richard sherman - "hey guys, next time we have drug tests I want Turbin to is sneak into the storage room through the vents and distort the samples like that one workaholics episode and they wont be able to suspend any of us for anything"

Turbin - "but I cant fit in the vents, my arms are too big from all the "adderall" ive been taking to study"

sherman - "as appealing as it sounds to get a nice, teamwide 4 week vacation, I guess we are all just going to have to appeal the results of our next drug test, cuz lets be real here we are all screwed"

Harvin - "hey guys, my teammates up in minnesota turned me onto this called a whizzinator, and now that Im so ridiculously overpaid I can afford to buy us all one!"

Lynch - "HAY GUYZZ! I Gotzz SkITtllzzz!!"

Sherm - "wait, those arent skittles, those are my adderall!! Errr Ummm, those arent mine!

Wilson - "im just gonna stand behind you guys and pretend I dont see you injecting yourselves. its gonna look bad when I run for president of the universe, but lets be real here its not like I could see over you anyways"

*pete carroll pops his head in* "hey guys, does anyone want any of these "smoothies" that I just had the doctors blend up? Its got this special ingredient... which I like to call hulk-juice Anxious "


I think every member of this team should be given a hair test. Bet all those dreds gets shaved off instantly Laughing Laughing
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Perfundle


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BangBang wrote:
They deserve it... they keep cheating. Make an example out of 'em.

They keep getting caught cheating. For all we know, the players are discussing better anti-detection strategies.
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hawksman81 wrote:
Jakuvious wrote:
imani wrote:
Cali2Wisco wrote:
imani wrote:
Persian Bolt wrote:
Take a draft pick away, that'll wake the team up.


The majority of these players were camp fodder, bench players at best. Not sure how that solves the problem for guys trying to make a roster.


Sherman and Irvin are camp fodder?


1. Sherman was never caught officially

2. Even if you count them both, that's 2, out of 6 players caught. Making them the minority and the camp fodder the majority. It believe it may be basic math, but i'm not certain.


And you're just conveniently choosing to omit Brandon Browner? Or is he camp fodder? Laughing


And John Moffitt. Embarassed
Hardly better than camp fodder at this point. Browner was an UDFA so maybe that's what imani means.
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Persian Bolt


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flaccomania wrote:
Persian Bolt wrote:
Adderral is probably used so they can read the playbook clearer since some of the players may have skipped classes in college and forgot how to read, who knows.


That's far from what's going on here.


I was being sarcastic. But on another note it just seems that recently wherever Pete Carroll is the head coach and running things, bad things get caught up after a few years he's there. What's up with that?
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imani


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jakuvious wrote:
imani wrote:
Cali2Wisco wrote:
imani wrote:
Persian Bolt wrote:
Take a draft pick away, that'll wake the team up.


The majority of these players were camp fodder, bench players at best. Not sure how that solves the problem for guys trying to make a roster.


Sherman and Irvin are camp fodder?


1. Sherman was never caught officially

2. Even if you count them both, that's 2, out of 6 players caught. Making them the minority and the camp fodder the majority. It believe it may be basic math, but i'm not certain.


And you're just conveniently choosing to omit Brandon Browner? Or is he camp fodder? Laughing


Not at all, just addressing what he posted. Even if we count sherman, that makes 7 total players linked to adderall, so that STILL would make it the minority with only 3. I said Depth player, camp fodder (should have use "or")..... John moffit is a depth player. Browner was the only starter caught (unless you count sherman). I don't see what's so hard about it

Shall i rephrase to appease people? Of players even linked to adderall/PEDs (7 total), only 3 have had any real impact on this team. 2 of those players were starters, and one was a role player. No matter how you slice it, that makes it the minority. Not understanding what the difficulty is. And i'm just giving you guys sherman in this scenario, because he was never found guilty of anything and continued to play at an all-pro level with constant passed tests after the "incident".
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Perfundle


Joined: 23 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
And i'm just giving you guys sherman in this scenario, because he was never found guilty of anything and continued to play at an all-pro level with constant passed tests after the "incident".

What I really find strange is that HGH (the supposed PED that Adderall is merely a cover for) apparently doesn't increase muscle strength. It would be utterly pathetic if athletes are risking getting caught taking something that isn't even that useful. As I understand it, HGH is much cheaper than anabolic steroids, and has far fewer and milder side effects, but is also much less effective as a performance enhancer. If Sherman really did take it and then stopped taking it, his continued elite performance is only another data point confirming this idea.
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iPwn


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perfundle wrote:
What I really find strange is that HGH (the supposed PED that Adderall is merely a cover for) apparently doesn't increase muscle strength. It would be utterly pathetic if athletes are risking getting caught taking something that isn't even that useful. As I understand it, HGH is much cheaper than anabolic steroids, and has far fewer and milder side effects, but is also much less effective as a performance enhancer. If Sherman really did take it and then stopped taking it, his continued elite performance is only another data point confirming this idea.
HGH is a naturally forming compound in the body. It's also a consumable illegal product, but to tray away from the drug talk, I'll talk about it as a natural compound and you can apply that however you see fit to the actual use. HGH's biggest impact over testosterone is that it helps with muscle growth and regeneration; from injuries to recovery from a workout/game. Withouth HGH forming naturally, a person's body would progressively break down much faster, and take far, far longer to heal than it currently does. Routine workouts would depleat you and cause muscle fatigue that lasted for days, if not weeks, depleating your ability to workout as much as possible. As you age and your body stops producing as much HGH (as well as other things), over the course of a long season, a player's play may begin to deteorate to the point of being less effective as others. That can largely be a contributing factor to why the rookie wall exists (those players aren't used to the long season), as well as why aging veterans tend to wear down as the season progresses more so than younger guys.


Apply that knowledge in a broader sense, and you might see why some would choose to seek out alternate forms of HGH.
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Perfundle


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iPwn wrote:
HGH's biggest impact over testosterone is that it helps with muscle growth and regeneration; from injuries to recovery from a workout/game.

That's not what the literature says. That isn't just one paper, it's a meta-analysis of several papers. Given that the literature does say that anabolic steroids do increase muscle strength, and therefore performance, I am willing to believe the results of the HGH meta-analysis. Regeneration I'll give you, but considering that athletes are recovering incredibly quickly from injuries using legal methods, that aspect of HGH should not be that important. HGH does apparently increase body mass and possibly muscle mass, and naive athletes might think that it increases muscle strength as well.
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perfundle wrote:
iPwn wrote:
HGH's biggest impact over testosterone is that it helps with muscle growth and regeneration; from injuries to recovery from a workout/game.

That's not what the literature says. That isn't just one paper, it's a meta-analysis of several papers. Given that the literature does say that anabolic steroids do increase muscle strength, and therefore performance, I am willing to believe the results of the HGH meta-analysis. Regeneration I'll give you, but considering that athletes are recovering incredibly quickly from injuries using legal methods, that aspect of HGH should not be that important. HGH does apparently increase body mass and possibly muscle mass, and naive athletes might think that it increases muscle strength as well.
Considering I didn't say it added strength, and the link you posted directly says that it increases lean mass (muscle growth), I'm not sure how it doesn't say what I said it does.

Regeneration is important, because it's not just regeneration from injuries, it's day to day regeneration. You know how after a workout, the next day your muscles are sore and you need to rest those muscles the next day or two, while you work on another group of muscles? It helps combat that, allowing for you to get back in the gym and work just as hard the next day, and over the course of a season, your compounded fatigue is lessened, allowing you to continue to perform at as high of a level in week 17 that you were in week 1, while everyone around you is fatigued more than you are.
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broncos67


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
Persian Bolt wrote:
Take a draft pick away, that'll wake the team up.


The majority of these players were camp fodder, bench players at best. Not sure how that solves the problem for guys trying to make a roster.


So what if they are? What, are we not going to punish guys who aren't set in stone at the position? I don't recall any team having as many issues with this as Seattle. Eventually something will need to be done.
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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

broncos67 wrote:
imani wrote:
Persian Bolt wrote:
Take a draft pick away, that'll wake the team up.


The majority of these players were camp fodder, bench players at best. Not sure how that solves the problem for guys trying to make a roster.


So what if they are? What, are we not going to punish guys who aren't set in stone at the position? I don't recall any team having as many issues with this as Seattle. Eventually something will need to be done.
Considering the Redskins have had more guys suspended for this in the past couple years...
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Perfundle


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PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iPwn wrote:
Considering I didn't say it added strength, and the link you posted directly says that it increases lean mass (muscle growth), I'm not sure how it doesn't say what I said it does.

Regeneration is important, because it's not just regeneration from injuries, it's day to day regeneration. You know how after a workout, the next day your muscles are sore and you need to rest those muscles the next day or two, while you work on another group of muscles? It helps combat that, allowing for you to get back in the gym and work just as hard the next day, and over the course of a season, your compounded fatigue is lessened, allowing you to continue to perform at as high of a level in week 17 that you were in week 1, while everyone around you is fatigued more than you are.

Yeah, I misread you there, although I'm not sure what muscle growth without corresponding increase in muscle strength is useful for.

Regarding regeneration, as I said, there are legal treatments there, like stem cell therapy, although I believe that's only for the more serious injuries. I don't understand why something like that is considered fully legal, while HGH isn't. Both involve injecting a foreign substance into the body, and if HGH indeed does not increase muscle strength, both seem to be used for making injuries heal faster. Is it all about the side effects? HGH by itself seems to have fairly mild ones.
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