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Hernandez charged with murder - Released by Pats II
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Jetsman82


Joined: 20 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In comparison to the Zimmerman trial, this is hardly a blip on the national radar, which is kind of odd. Regardless, it's not even the biggest trial right now, let alone ever.
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Mancunian Raven


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jetsman82 wrote:
In comparison to the Zimmerman trial, this is hardly a blip on the national radar, which is kind of odd. Regardless, it's not even the biggest trial right now, let alone ever.


Well, it's not a trial yet. He's just had an arraignment and a bail denial appeal. And now all we're getting are the 'expert' opinions on NFL Network and ESPN, because no one actually connected to the case is saying much of anything.

Once the trial actually begins, the prosecution starts detailing the charges more than they already have, and the defense begins to make its case, then I'd expect it to become bigger news again.

The OJ Simpson trial was perfect television drama, with the live police chase, the racial overtones, the easily identifiable images of him trying on the gloves. Plus, don't forget the guy was known as an actor by then, as well as a football player.
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tinoynk


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yea OJ himself and the case/trial was on another level. Personally I find this to be just as chilling and disturbing, but OJ was a legit household name by the early 90s. He was a college star, a legendary NFL player and had been in a bunch of movies. He was charismatic and likeable and he was 100% in the mainstream, not just a pretty good football player. The average grandma would have probably heard of OJ before the murder accusations started, not so with Aaron Hernandez even now.
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ChicagoAl


Joined: 10 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcmurtry86 wrote:
spilltray wrote:
BenchSanchez wrote:
patdt13 wrote:
It really doesn't matter who pulled the trigger. All 3 were there and knew what was happening.


Sure it does. Especially if they begin to plea and spill the beans, trigger man would get the most time if they get a good plea deal. It could swing any which was right now though.

But saying it doesn't matter is pure silliness.


Not really. It doesn't matter. All were together, complicit and cooperating. No matter who pulled the trigger, it's all the same. I've used this example before:

If all 3 of them robbed a bank, and one of them shot someone, It's murder for all of them. They were all part of it and there really isn't the need for the prosecution to limit it to one of them.


The bank robbery example would be a case of the Felony Murder Rule. The rule isn't going to apply in the Hernandez case. The other 2 guys can go down for accessory without going down for murder.
Conspiracy to commit murder is clearly a felony.
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chiefer wrote:
BillSabre wrote:
Chiefer wrote:
boondock wrote:
Chiefer wrote:
What if all 3 aren't snitches?

That just throws a loop in any sort of plea deal.


Prosecution will have to really tighten their agenda if that's the case.

Hernandez could conceivably get off the murder charges with all the mostly circumstantial evidence.

Do they have the actual gun used?


Dude, have you seen all the "circumstantial" evidence. There isn't a jury in the world that wouldn't convict him. I'm sorry but this is as simple as playing connect the dots. . . . . . . <------ could you make a straight line? This guy is guilty, it's pretty clear.

Meh I've seen millionaires get off with more evidence against them.
Who? When?
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SwiftTexan wrote:
I know it looks like the right move now because few expect Hernandez to play in the NFL again but I'm still shocked the Pats released him so quickly. It looks grim right now but who knows what can happen during the course of a trial. Ray Lewis stayed on the team and that worked out pretty well for Ray and the Ravens.

Let's say hypothetically AH manages to work a plea deal where he spends a year in jail for obstruction or whatever. Then the NFL bans him for another year (i.e. like Vick). He'll still only be 25 by the start of the 2015 season. If I'm a GM, I'd be willing to take a chance on AH's talent on a contract similar to Vick's first and roll the dice that he learned his lesson. Another team could really benefit from the Pats extreme desire to distance themselves from Hernandez.

It's unlikely but not impossible. AH is not some depth player. He's young and one of the best at his position. I'm surprised the Pats were willing to drop him so quickly. It might have been smarter to wait considering they've made it harder on themselves to recoup some of his salary. Ultimately it was the most shocking part of this whole thing. We're so used to star players getting a longer leash.

Edit: Just to be clear - I don't expect AH to play in the NFL again but I'm sure people didn't think Ray would ever play again during the early stages of the investigation/trial. I know the two are not the same but it's the closest comparison we have.
"...learned his lesson..." Laughing That is pretty funny. Did he come from a jungle and not know murder was not to be done?
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keleth wrote:
vikingshomer wrote:
Ring Worm Sherm wrote:
You can't mention ray lewis in this thread? Its relevant to the story. But anyways, I think these other guys coming into the picture could potentially help AH. The more guys there is the harder it should be for them to determine who pulled the trigger. I guess it could also be worse if he did indeed do it and they rat. But having more suspects makes it tougher to specially make him the killer IMO. He's still screwed either way though.
You don't have to be the guy who actually pulled the trigger to be convicted of murder. If you orchestrated the murder you are just as guilty as the guy who pulled the trigger. The more witnesses there are the worse this is for AH. Everyone will eventually start talking.


I know very little about US law but isn't there some sort of law that if in the commission of a federal offence (I presume murder is a federal offence) murder is committed then everyone taking part in that offence can be guilty of murder despite them not being the specific person who committed the murder ?
Murder is not a federal offense. These crimes, like most, are prosecuted in STATE courts. State courts are the first line of defense against crime. Murder committed as a conspiracy might open up federal jurisdiction.
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iPwn wrote:
mfw096 wrote:
Crazy situation. I really do hope he gets the death pentaly though instead of wasting tax dollars on him being in prison for the rest of his life.
It costs more money to execute someone than life in prison does.
Not really. Most of the costs incident to an execution are there with non-DP sentences. Endless appeals, weigh rooms, tvs, can be had by all.
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mfw096 wrote:
Question? I'm at a bar and I'm not going to look it up right now, but how does it cost more to execute someone then life in prison.
Endless appeals. We pay for their lawyers. An actual execution costs almost nothing.
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ArodFanboy


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChicagoAl wrote:
mfw096 wrote:
Question? I'm at a bar and I'm not going to look it up right now, but how does it cost more to execute someone then life in prison.
Endless appeals. We pay for their lawyers. An actual execution costs almost nothing.


This. Look up guys like Randy Steven Kraft, Rodney Alcala and even Ted Bundy who played the system like a flute for years on Death Row. Everyone knew they were/are guilty, that wasn't the problem though.
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iPwn


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, that's not why. The vast majority of the cost comes from the trial and pre-trial protections and rules that need be followed. The post-trial stuff is a mere pittance compared to everything else that is done beforehand.
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Dawgpoun8017


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

@ProFootballTalk: Ernest Wallace going back to Massachusetts http://wp.me/p14QSB-9cTf


IMO this is bad news for AH
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24isthelaw


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dawgpoun8017 wrote:
Quote:

@ProFootballTalk: Ernest Wallace going back to Massachusetts http://wp.me/p14QSB-9cTf


IMO this is bad news for AH


Bet they've had Wallace in the bag for a while and he's been telling them everything he knows.
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Dawgpoun8017


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

24isthelaw wrote:
Dawgpoun8017 wrote:
Quote:

@ProFootballTalk: Ernest Wallace going back to Massachusetts http://wp.me/p14QSB-9cTf


IMO this is bad news for AH


Bet they've had Wallace in the bag for a while and he's been telling them everything he knows.


This is my thought as well, the prosecution wants Hernandez IMO and they will charge Wallace but be like tell us everything and we will talk lighter sentence
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChicagoAl wrote:
mcmurtry86 wrote:
spilltray wrote:
BenchSanchez wrote:
patdt13 wrote:
It really doesn't matter who pulled the trigger. All 3 were there and knew what was happening.


Sure it does. Especially if they begin to plea and spill the beans, trigger man would get the most time if they get a good plea deal. It could swing any which was right now though.

But saying it doesn't matter is pure silliness.


Not really. It doesn't matter. All were together, complicit and cooperating. No matter who pulled the trigger, it's all the same. I've used this example before:

If all 3 of them robbed a bank, and one of them shot someone, It's murder for all of them. They were all part of it and there really isn't the need for the prosecution to limit it to one of them.


The bank robbery example would be a case of the Felony Murder Rule. The rule isn't going to apply in the Hernandez case. The other 2 guys can go down for accessory without going down for murder.
Conspiracy to commit murder is clearly a felony.


And I'm sure any half decent defense attorney would argue that the conspiracy to commit would fall under the merger doctrine and not make his accomplices eligible for the Felony Murder Rule.
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