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Superman(DH23)
Joined: 03 Jan 2008
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 Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 8:45 pm Post subject: |
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| GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | Timothy67 wrote: | | jrry32 wrote: |
With Rivera and Marinelli, their defenses did quite well. |
What is your point? Lovie had no problem what so ever scapegoating Rivera and firing him after they lost the Superbowl. |
He didn't scapegoat Rivera, why would he have to scapegoat any coach, they just made it to the SuperBowl. He never wanted Rivera to begin with, he was assigned to him. He didn't like the way Ron defended the run (go look up Ron Rivera run defenses) and so he declined to renew the contract. Maybe Bob Babich wasn't the best hire, but he also wasn't anywhere near as bad as Bears fans like to insist. |
Babich wasnt the best hire? That's putting it mildly.Although it wasnt surprising that he was the one to take over. Basically Lovie's puppet. What was even worse was putting himself in charge of the defense. Almost got himself fired  .
Not renewing Rivera's contract was a mistake and Lovie realizes this now because he absolutely hates to talk about it. |
Considering a Ron Rivera coached D never outranked a Lovie/Rod coached D, it sure doesn't seem a mistake to me. And if you recall it wasn't Manning that killed us in that SuperBowl, it was Dominic Rhodes and Joe Addai. Ron Rivera's run D was atrocious.
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GOGRIESE
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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Location: Austin Texas
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | Timothy67 wrote: | | jrry32 wrote: |
With Rivera and Marinelli, their defenses did quite well. |
What is your point? Lovie had no problem what so ever scapegoating Rivera and firing him after they lost the Superbowl. |
He didn't scapegoat Rivera, why would he have to scapegoat any coach, they just made it to the SuperBowl. He never wanted Rivera to begin with, he was assigned to him. He didn't like the way Ron defended the run (go look up Ron Rivera run defenses) and so he declined to renew the contract. Maybe Bob Babich wasn't the best hire, but he also wasn't anywhere near as bad as Bears fans like to insist. |
Babich wasnt the best hire? That's putting it mildly.Although it wasnt surprising that he was the one to take over. Basically Lovie's puppet. What was even worse was putting himself in charge of the defense. Almost got himself fired .
Not renewing Rivera's contract was a mistake and Lovie realizes this now because he absolutely hates to talk about it. |
Considering a Ron Rivera coached D never outranked a Lovie/Rod coached D, it sure doesn't seem a mistake to me. And if you recall it wasn't Manning that killed us in that SuperBowl, it was Dominic Rhodes and Joe Addai. Ron Rivera's run D was atrocious. |
Why are we talking about Rod? That was basically 4 years later. Between then we were still searching for an answer to replace him. That 2009 Lovie defense was one of the worst I've ever seen before. You can blame Rivera for the SB loss fine. Blame Lovie for not finding an adequate replacement and wasting a few years.
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Superman(DH23)
Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 19874
Location: Abdi on the sick sig
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 8:59 pm Post subject: |
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| GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | Timothy67 wrote: | | jrry32 wrote: |
With Rivera and Marinelli, their defenses did quite well. |
What is your point? Lovie had no problem what so ever scapegoating Rivera and firing him after they lost the Superbowl. |
He didn't scapegoat Rivera, why would he have to scapegoat any coach, they just made it to the SuperBowl. He never wanted Rivera to begin with, he was assigned to him. He didn't like the way Ron defended the run (go look up Ron Rivera run defenses) and so he declined to renew the contract. Maybe Bob Babich wasn't the best hire, but he also wasn't anywhere near as bad as Bears fans like to insist. |
Babich wasnt the best hire? That's putting it mildly.Although it wasnt surprising that he was the one to take over. Basically Lovie's puppet. What was even worse was putting himself in charge of the defense. Almost got himself fired .
Not renewing Rivera's contract was a mistake and Lovie realizes this now because he absolutely hates to talk about it. |
Considering a Ron Rivera coached D never outranked a Lovie/Rod coached D, it sure doesn't seem a mistake to me. And if you recall it wasn't Manning that killed us in that SuperBowl, it was Dominic Rhodes and Joe Addai. Ron Rivera's run D was atrocious. |
Why are we talking about Rod? That was basically 4 years later. Between then we were still searching for an answer to replace him. That 2009 Lovie defense was one of the worst I've ever seen before. You can blame Rivera for the SB loss fine. Blame Lovie for not finding an adequate replacement and wasting a few years. |
It's already been discussed even when the Bears were in the middle of the pack in total defense and scoring defense, they were still top 10 in ypplay and pts per drive. A lot of the defensive rankings can be directly attributed to the offense (2007 & 2008 particularly). In 2009 do you remember the first game of the year? They had shut Aaron Rodgers down. Then Lach went down for the year. At one point we were starting our 5th, 6th, & 7th LB. The DL was starting Matt Toeaina and Jimmy Kennedy. Ogunleye was in the twilight of his career. That was an injury plagued season, not completely unlike this one, yet they still finished #14 in scoring defense & #16 in total defense. And that while being the worst in the league on 3rd down, and our worst takeaway performance under Lovie. Oh and Jay gave the opponent 26 extra possessions that year too.
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GOGRIESE
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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Location: Austin Texas
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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And yet you want to fire Mel Tucker but none of that was Lovie's fault....nice consistency
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Superman(DH23)
Joined: 03 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| GOGRIESE wrote: | | And yet you want to fire Mel Tucker but none of that was Lovie's fault....nice consistency |
Love's "bad" year still produced a middle of the road defense. Mel Tucker just produced a defense that was last in run defense, 27th in pass defense, 31st in 3rd down%, 32nd in yards per play, and 30th in scoring. Yeah I want Tucker fired. Not sure how you can even compare.
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GOGRIESE
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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Location: Austin Texas
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | And yet you want to fire Mel Tucker but none of that was Lovie's fault....nice consistency |
Love's "bad" year still produced a middle of the road defense. Mel Tucker just produced a defense that was last in run defense, 27th in pass defense, 31st in 3rd down%, 32nd in yards per play, and 30th in scoring. Yeah I want Tucker fired. Not sure how you can even compare. |
Why is bad in quotations? It was a bad year. Remember the Bengals game? Was that a middle of the road defense playing? Cedric Benson probably didnt think so. But I dont know why I'm even arguing with you. Lovie can do no wrong in your eyes.
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Superman(DH23)
Joined: 03 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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| GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | And yet you want to fire Mel Tucker but none of that was Lovie's fault....nice consistency |
Love's "bad" year still produced a middle of the road defense. Mel Tucker just produced a defense that was last in run defense, 27th in pass defense, 31st in 3rd down%, 32nd in yards per play, and 30th in scoring. Yeah I want Tucker fired. Not sure how you can even compare. |
Why is bad in quotations? It was a bad year. Remember the Bengals game? Was that a middle of the road defense playing? Cedric Benson probably didnt think so. But I dont know why I'm even arguing with you. Lovie can do no wrong in your eyes. |
Since when do we judge a defense by a singular game? The Bears D looked pretty bad against the 49ers in 2012, does that mean they were bad? And I love how my differing opinion of Lovie means that he can do no wrong in my eyes. I have criticized him for stuff in the past that I didn't agree with (including Bob Babich). I love you like a lil bro Even tho you are completely wrong in your opinion about Lovie.
Edit: sorry to answer your question, Lovie's "bad" year was in fact avg. Tucker's bad year was just bad.
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TheKillerNacho
Joined: 10 Feb 2008
Posts: 15015
Location: Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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| GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | And yet you want to fire Mel Tucker but none of that was Lovie's fault....nice consistency |
Love's "bad" year still produced a middle of the road defense. Mel Tucker just produced a defense that was last in run defense, 27th in pass defense, 31st in 3rd down%, 32nd in yards per play, and 30th in scoring. Yeah I want Tucker fired. Not sure how you can even compare. |
Why is bad in quotations? It was a bad year. Remember the Bengals game? Was that a middle of the road defense playing? Cedric Benson probably didnt think so. But I dont know why I'm even arguing with you. Lovie can do no wrong in your eyes. |
I think he was illuminating the fact that Lovie Smith's worst hour was still better than Tucker's this season.
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GOGRIESE
Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Posts: 25936
Location: Austin Texas
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| Posted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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| TheKillerNacho wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | And yet you want to fire Mel Tucker but none of that was Lovie's fault....nice consistency |
Love's "bad" year still produced a middle of the road defense. Mel Tucker just produced a defense that was last in run defense, 27th in pass defense, 31st in 3rd down%, 32nd in yards per play, and 30th in scoring. Yeah I want Tucker fired. Not sure how you can even compare. |
Why is bad in quotations? It was a bad year. Remember the Bengals game? Was that a middle of the road defense playing? Cedric Benson probably didnt think so. But I dont know why I'm even arguing with you. Lovie can do no wrong in your eyes. |
I think he was illuminating the fact that Lovie Smith's worst hour was still better than Tucker's this season. |
I know exactly what he as alluding to and I just simply dont agree with it. But Superman and I have had this argument before(Lovie's impact on defense).
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Johnny3000
Joined: 27 Nov 2013
Posts: 88
Location: Harrisburg, PA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 12:45 am Post subject: |
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I'd say this is a pretty decent hire. Lovie Smith has proven he's capable of taking a team to the Super Bowl, but the Bears also had several mediocre seasons under him. I do think he'll do a good job at utilizing Tampa Bay's talent on defense.
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GoneWithTheWind
Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 2015
Location: MadTown
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| Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Johnny3000 wrote: | | I'd say this is a pretty decent hire. Lovie Smith has proven he's capable of taking a team to the Super Bowl, but the Bears also had several mediocre seasons under him. I do think he'll do a good job at utilizing Tampa Bay's talent on defense. |
Tampa has really good personal overall for Lovie's defense with the great D-line and he'll be able to adjust his defense enough to allow Revis to play man to man and could have an elite defense right away if the pieces fall right. Excited to see Lovie back in the NFL but out of the NFC North very underrated coach.
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Timothy67
Joined: 22 Nov 2011
Posts: 1403
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| Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 7:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | Timothy67 wrote: | | jrry32 wrote: |
With Rivera and Marinelli, their defenses did quite well. |
What is your point? Lovie had no problem what so ever scapegoating Rivera and firing him after they lost the Superbowl. |
He didn't scapegoat Rivera, why would he have to scapegoat any coach, they just made it to the SuperBowl. He never wanted Rivera to begin with, he was assigned to him. He didn't like the way Ron defended the run (go look up Ron Rivera run defenses) and so he declined to renew the contract. Maybe Bob Babich wasn't the best hire, but he also wasn't anywhere near as bad as Bears fans like to insist. |
Babich wasnt the best hire? That's putting it mildly.Although it wasnt surprising that he was the one to take over. Basically Lovie's puppet. What was even worse was putting himself in charge of the defense. Almost got himself fired .
Not renewing Rivera's contract was a mistake and Lovie realizes this now because he absolutely hates to talk about it. |
Considering a Ron Rivera coached D never outranked a Lovie/Rod coached D, it sure doesn't seem a mistake to me. And if you recall it wasn't Manning that killed us in that SuperBowl, it was Dominic Rhodes and Joe Addai. Ron Rivera's run D was atrocious. |
The Colts were held to 22 points. Any competent HC with a decent OC should have won that game, all they needed was a decent consistent offense.
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Timothy67
Joined: 22 Nov 2011
Posts: 1403
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| Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| GOGRIESE wrote: | | TheKillerNacho wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | Superman(DH23) wrote: | | GOGRIESE wrote: | | And yet you want to fire Mel Tucker but none of that was Lovie's fault....nice consistency |
Love's "bad" year still produced a middle of the road defense. Mel Tucker just produced a defense that was last in run defense, 27th in pass defense, 31st in 3rd down%, 32nd in yards per play, and 30th in scoring. Yeah I want Tucker fired. Not sure how you can even compare. |
Why is bad in quotations? It was a bad year. Remember the Bengals game? Was that a middle of the road defense playing? Cedric Benson probably didnt think so. But I dont know why I'm even arguing with you. Lovie can do no wrong in your eyes. |
I think he was illuminating the fact that Lovie Smith's worst hour was still better than Tucker's this season. |
I know exactly what he as alluding to and I just simply dont agree with it. But Superman and I have had this argument before(Lovie's impact on defense). |
Part of me wishes Lovie had been given one more year, the defense would have been a small bit better this year but it would have still been old and injured and with Lovie's crap offense the Bears would have been lucky to get 6 wins. Then the undead horror that is "Lovie is a defensive genius" could have a stake put through its heart for good.
It wont matter Lovie has no offense to look at in Tampa, at least not one made to win, so the team is going to flounder since Lovie is being given the keys to the kingdom to make all major decisions.
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Casto
Joined: 06 Jun 2013
Posts: 120
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| Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Odds of Chud to Bucs as OC?? |
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chris00cm
Joined: 01 Feb 2008
Posts: 19668
Location: St. Charles, Missouri
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| Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 10:41 pm Post subject: |
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Leslie Frazier will be their defensive coordinator, as many expected.
There's a reason to be excited if you are a Buccaneers fan.
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