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Lane Johnson Suspended Four Games due to PED Violation
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Harper41


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.
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organ donor


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


LOL
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WhackyPlague


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HTTRG3Dynasty wrote:
Anyone think the questions raised in this article hold merit?

http://espn.go.com/blog/philadelphia-eagles/post/_/id/6089/issues-raised-by-johnson-ped-report

Quote:
Taking a step back, a suspension would cast doubts upon more than just Johnson.

Head coach Chip Kelly has gotten a lot of attention for his training methods and his sports science-based approach to football. It didn't raise many questions when linebacker Jake Knott was suspended earlier this year. But now, with a first-round pick and starter reportedly testing positive for PEDs, there will be plenty of speculation about what's in those custom smoothies the players drink after every practice.

Johnson would be the fifth Eagles player suspended for performance enhancing drugs. This would be the first time, however, that two Eagles have tested positive in the same year. Instead of a minor player whose absence would barely be noticed, Knott becomes part of a trend for the 2013 NFC East champions. If there are no more positive tests, there will be no more suspicions. But if the trend continues, questions will be asked
.


Nah, Sheridan is a hack.

I'm sure lots of NFL players use PEDs in one form or another, but I *highly* doubt any teams provide them directly. Far too risky. At most a strength and conditioning coach might provide connections or something.
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The Hitch


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beatnik wrote:
The Hitch wrote:
WhackyPlague wrote:
Stupid.

Barbre should be okay as a replacement, but still stupid.


I don't think its stupid. Doping history suggests a large number of athletes in all sports are doping, and tests are nowhere near advanced enough to catch anything but a minority.


When doping invade a sport, it's very easy to see and it did'nt happen really often. The signs don't lie: You see no names becoming superstars (sometimes late in the career), records are being broken by huge margin etc.

The only examples i can think of are MLB 1997-2003, Cycling since before Amstrong up until now, 100 M running in the 80's and then in the last years.

There is probably many olympic sports i don't know enough but in professional sports I don't think it's widespread.


Those are some catergories you seem to have invented yourself. Those things can be suggestive of doping but it's wrong to say that if you don't see a world record or older athletes performing, there is no doping.
Btw your making an immediate mistake in thinking of doping purely as an absolute performance enhancer when historically it's been just as prominent in injury recovery.

And it's not like athletic speed and strength is regressing or anything in the fireplace.
Investigations into the subject have all shown that doping goes well beyond the minority of sports that get scaoegoated for it (Puerto for example showed it's widespread in European soccer and tennis which used its power to destroy the evidence).

Anyway the economic realities of doping and physical realities of modern professional sport make the idea that everyone stopped 10 years ago unrealistic. Athletes put their bodies under immense pressure,go through Hell with injuries, concussions, have a 5-10 year window to make as much money as possible before their career finishes and live in the most competitive environment there is. To believe peds wouldn't thrive there, it's like believing that an inner city housing project would be free of recreational drugs. The Goldman dilema shows that statistically most athletes are willing to take the health risks. It's only the legal risks that one would be taking and seeing how in the nfl they only ban you for a few games anyway (as opposed to 2 years in Olympics) and tests are generally easy to beat to begin with, moreso for millionaires, I don't think that's a factor either. Unless you believe they all stopped for.moral reasons
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Withmy89vision


Joined: 07 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

organ donor wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


LOL


I agree with him. You are crazy if you don't think the vast majority of players take PEDs
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wwhickok


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


d'oh!

In all seriousness, I think we might not be all the surprised at the number of guys in the NFL using some form of PED's that just haven't gotten caught.

Here's a question though, does anyone think that the reason people like Johnson do so is because they wouldnt' be very good players without them?

What I mean is, I think it's fair to argue that Lane Johnson, being an OT and all, would be using them to improve his upper body strength against Defensive linemen and LBs (a common use for it in any respective position, against respective opponents).

Without it, do you think it might be fair to argue that he would simply be an average or mediocre player that struggles against defenders because of a lack of natural strength?

In asking this question, I'm not condoning or condeming it, I'm simply trying to understand the logic of taking the risk of getting caught because of its use.
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WhackyPlague


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wwhickok wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


d'oh!

In all seriousness, I think we might not be all the surprised at the number of guys in the NFL using some form of PED's that just haven't gotten caught.

Here's a question though, does anyone think that the reason people like Johnson do so is because they wouldnt' be very good players without them?

What I mean is, I think it's fair to argue that Lane Johnson, being an OT and all, would be using them to improve his upper body strength against Defensive linemen and LBs (a common use for it in any respective position, against respective opponents).

Without it, do you think it might be fair to argue that he would simply be an average or mediocre player that struggles against defenders because of a lack of natural strength?

In asking this question, I'm not condoning or condeming it, I'm simply trying to understand the logic of taking the risk of getting caught because of its use.


We don't know what he got caught using (and may never know), so it's hard to say just based off of that. Not all PEDs improve strength. Many of the drugs on the NFL banned list are weight loss supplements, for example. Even HGH doesn't appear to directly increase strength, it speeds up injury recovery (which obviously has some benefits for workouts), though obviously the NFL doesn't really test for HGH.

As for the logic of using it - if everyone in the NFL is using PEDs, then you'd be forced to use PEDs just to keep up with everyone else.
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Morkim


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


You don't want to see the man behind the curtain.
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Withmy89vision


Joined: 07 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wwhickok wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


d'oh!

In all seriousness, I think we might not be all the surprised at the number of guys in the NFL using some form of PED's that just haven't gotten caught.

Here's a question though, does anyone think that the reason people like Johnson do so is because they wouldnt' be very good players without them?

What I mean is, I think it's fair to argue that Lane Johnson, being an OT and all, would be using them to improve his upper body strength against Defensive linemen and LBs (a common use for it in any respective position, against respective opponents).

Without it, do you think it might be fair to argue that he would simply be an average or mediocre player that struggles against defenders because of a lack of natural strength?

In asking this question, I'm not condoning or condeming it, I'm simply trying to understand the logic of taking the risk of getting caught because of its use.



Well of course, but there's also the dlinemen and LBs using PEDs Lane and other olinemen have to keep up with. If all the dline is using PEDs and the olines aren't, or vice versa, it won't go too well.

But really, most PEDs aren't used to make people stronger or faster though that does happen as a side effect. Most PEDs are used for healing faster or for weight gain/loss.
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domepatrol91


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Withmy89vision wrote:
organ donor wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


LOL


I agree with him. You are crazy if you don't think the vast majority of players take PEDs


Same. I never care when guys take PEDs, it doesn't really make me think any less of them.

Just doesn't bother me I guess.


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wwhickok


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the responses to my question guys, that all makes sense. I genuinely don't know enough about PED's to have speculated on what the motivation behind them is tbh.
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organ donor


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Withmy89vision wrote:
organ donor wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


LOL


I agree with him. You are crazy if you don't think the vast majority of players take PEDs


Cool, it's nice to know I'm not crazy then, I guess. [removed]

Saying steroid use is okay and that they should hide it better I don't agree with. There's also a good portion of players who don't cheat. Just because a lot of players do it, doesn't make it right and those guys deserve to get caught.

-Absolutely no reason to tie marijuana use into this discussion, especially since it's against forum rules.
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Withmy89vision


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

organ donor wrote:
Withmy89vision wrote:
organ donor wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


LOL


I agree with him. You are crazy if you don't think the vast majority of players take PEDs


Cool, it's nice to know I'm not crazy then, I guess. [removed]

Saying steroid use is okay and that they should hide it better I don't agree with. There's also a good portion of players who don't cheat. Just because a lot of players do it, doesn't make it right and those guys deserve to get caught.

-Absolutely no reason to tie marijuana use into this discussion, especially since it's against forum rules.



The health effects of steroids and PEDs have been vastly exaggerated just like every other illegal drug, and the whole sport is dangerous. I don't understand why we encourage an activity that is all but guaranteed to cause some kind of harm, with the very real possibility of crippling injuries or even death, but then we worry about the things that help them do this sport.
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RandyMossIsBoss


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wwhickok wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Meh. I always found steroid suspensions stupid but whatever. Hopefully Lane hides it better next time.


d'oh!

In all seriousness, I think we might not be all the surprised at the number of guys in the NFL using some form of PED's that just haven't gotten caught.

Here's a question though, does anyone think that the reason people like Johnson do so is because they wouldnt' be very good players without them?

What I mean is, I think it's fair to argue that Lane Johnson, being an OT and all, would be using them to improve his upper body strength against Defensive linemen and LBs (a common use for it in any respective position, against respective opponents).

Without it, do you think it might be fair to argue that he would simply be an average or mediocre player that struggles against defenders because of a lack of natural strength?

In asking this question, I'm not condoning or condeming it, I'm simply trying to understand the logic of taking the risk of getting caught because of its use.
Steroids certainly would help an offensive lineman, since strength is important for linemen and steroids obviously are going to speed up the strength gaining process. However, I highly doubt steroids alone are going to make or break an offensive lineman. If you're an elite player on steroids, you're still probably going to be a pretty damn good player, if not equal, without them. Steroids aren't helping your footwork, balance and agility, all of which are equally important to strength for an offensive lineman. I'd be very surprised if we saw any drop-off in Lane's play, in fact we'll probably see improvement due to an offseason of training and coaching.
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Dubyajay


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wwhickok wrote:
Thanks for the responses to my question guys, that all makes sense. I genuinely don't know enough about PED's to have speculated on what the motivation behind them is tbh.


Go watch Bigger, Stronger, Faster. Informative and a pretty entertaining documentary. It's on YouTube.
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